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1Back to top Go down    timing case removal on Mon Apr 25, 2016 4:35 pm

SniperX

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I have the valve cover and bottom end covers off and all the fasteners  can see off the timing case cover. Do I remove the two fasteners holding the hall effects sensor plate and put it out of the way then just carefully pull the timing case off or is there a trick? And is there any timing needed when I put the hall effects sensor back on?


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1972 BMW 3.0CSL, 1985 BMW Dinan 535i, 2001 Honda XR400R (plated), 1985 K100RT, 2004 ZX3 Focus, 1991 Dodge Power Wagon 4x4. 1977 Plymouth Trailduster 35K original miles!
    

2Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Mon Apr 25, 2016 5:32 pm

Holister

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Scribe a mark on the timing plate before you remove it.
Be aware, there are two small half moon washers under the timing plate on the  two fixing screws. Note how they are positioned
Pull the oil pressure wire out leaving a trace wire so the oil wire can be pulled back thru when reassembling. The timing chain cover won't come away with the oil wire in place.
Just hang the oil wire and timing plate and wiring up out of the road.
Follow your manual's instructions on getting #1cylinder to tdc BEFORE removing the chain.
When undoing the timing cover bolts, untension them all a ¼ turn before undoing them completely otherwise the last bolt may bind and you could strip the bolt head trying to remove it. Embarassed

Cheers



Last edited by Kaptain Holister on Tue Apr 26, 2016 3:03 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : reworded last parra)


__________________________________________________
1988 K100RT     VIN No.  0094680
1989 K100RT     VIN No.  0097367 (naked)  
1996 K1100RS   VIN No.  0451808
     Fuel:  95 Octane
Engine Oil: Nulon Full Synthetic 15W50
Gear Box Oil:  Nulon Synthetic 75W90
    

3Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Tue Apr 26, 2016 1:24 am

RicK G

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You need to remove the hall sensor plate and then you see 3 small allen scews that hold the metal cup onto the end of the crankshaft. Remove the 3 screws and carefully remove the cup (it can be bent easily). You can then remove the 14 screws that hold the cover and remove it.


__________________________________________________
If everything seems under control then you aint goin fast enough:- Mario Andretti
Bikes 1986 K100RT, 1993 K1100 LT, 1994 K1100 LT, 1993 K75 RT, 1996 K75RT, 1986 K75 GS, 1979 Z1300 Kawasaki X 2 & 1976 SR 500 Yamaha for now
    

4Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Tue Apr 26, 2016 9:06 am

charlie99

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in addition to ricks suggestion

the hall effect  "cup " that fits between the vanes of the hall effects ...is located by a small spigot in the base to get it located correctly on the crank shaft

so no worries about that bit at all

good luck


__________________________________________________
cheezy grin whilst riding, kinda bloke ....oh the joy !!!! ...... ( brick aviator )

'86 K100 RT..#0090401 ..."Gerty" ( Gertrude Von Clickandshift ) --------O%O
    

5Back to top Go down    timing cover trace wire on Tue Apr 26, 2016 10:45 am

GF Wollongong

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Don't forget the trace wire.

I did it right the first time and total forgot about it second time ... after I had put the thin wipe of RTV blue silastic on the cover and then got distracted...beer

It is possible but a PITA to thread a trace / pull wire through from the bottom. Use thin tie wire (thinner than coat hanger wire) and hook it through then tape it up (cable ties will catch)

Also, having pulled the rubber boot off the bottom of the oil pressure switch wire it is difficult to get it back over the circular (washer shaped) end of the wire. 

My solution to this was to snip two cuts into the small end of the boot (at say 9 and 3 o'clock) and then the boot will slide over it easily. Not sure how water proof it is

Guy

    

6Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Tue Apr 26, 2016 8:41 pm

SniperX

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Any pics of this pump wire, where it attaches and possibly a trace wire in place? I don't know where it is since the cover is still on. I'll be doing it this weekend. Thanks all for the replies! You blokes always make these projects go smoothly!


__________________________________________________
1972 BMW 3.0CSL, 1985 BMW Dinan 535i, 2001 Honda XR400R (plated), 1985 K100RT, 2004 ZX3 Focus, 1991 Dodge Power Wagon 4x4. 1977 Plymouth Trailduster 35K original miles!
    

7Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Wed Apr 27, 2016 1:03 am

Holister

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I doubt there are any pictures around of that. Its really not a crucial part of the teardown process. Its just that you won't be able to totally remove the timing chain cover untill you pull the oil pressure wire out first. Pulling the wire out is easy.... threading it back thru afterwards is not so easy.

Here's a 1,000 words instead.

  1. Detach the wire from the oil pressure sensor located on the oil/water pump beneath the front of the engine and remove the rubber boot from the end of the wire.
  2. Fix another piece of wire about 50cm of similar gauge to the end of the oil pressure wire using electrical tape. Make sure its secure.
  3. Remove the 'T' shaped timing cover and locate the oil pressure wire which dissappears thru a hole at the bottom.
  4. Carefully jiggle this wire up and out pulling the trace wire with it but leaving the trace wire running thru the casing.
  5. Detach the oil pressure wire from the trace wire.


After you remove the timing plate and cup, all the wiring from behind the 'T' shaped timing cover will come away when you remove the rubber grommet at the top. After you've removed the bolts from the larger timing chain cover, that cover will pull off over the trace wire leaving the trace wire running thru the engine casing. This is used to pull the oil pressure sensor wire back thru after the covers have been repalced.


__________________________________________________
1988 K100RT     VIN No.  0094680
1989 K100RT     VIN No.  0097367 (naked)  
1996 K1100RS   VIN No.  0451808
     Fuel:  95 Octane
Engine Oil: Nulon Full Synthetic 15W50
Gear Box Oil:  Nulon Synthetic 75W90
    

8Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Wed Apr 27, 2016 4:55 am

SniperX

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So, reason for the trace wire is due to the pump wire being too short to be easily threaded back thru the hole upon reassembly then mate?


__________________________________________________
1972 BMW 3.0CSL, 1985 BMW Dinan 535i, 2001 Honda XR400R (plated), 1985 K100RT, 2004 ZX3 Focus, 1991 Dodge Power Wagon 4x4. 1977 Plymouth Trailduster 35K original miles!
    

9Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Wed Apr 27, 2016 11:56 am

Dai

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Not too short: you'll be trying to jiggle a female spade connector back through the timing cover and it's going to snag on every tiny flaw in the casting that it can find.


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'83 K100 upgraded to K100RS spec
Others...
'78 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, '79 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,'93 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California,
'03 Suzuki Blandit GSF600SK3 (NFS any more because wifey has claimed it)
    

10Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Wed Apr 27, 2016 8:40 pm

SniperX

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Ah ha, so it's one of those. Got it.


__________________________________________________
1972 BMW 3.0CSL, 1985 BMW Dinan 535i, 2001 Honda XR400R (plated), 1985 K100RT, 2004 ZX3 Focus, 1991 Dodge Power Wagon 4x4. 1977 Plymouth Trailduster 35K original miles!
    

11Back to top Go down    Got all the chain and compenets done today on Mon May 16, 2016 12:24 am

SniperX

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Replaced all the guides, tensioner and chain. The old tensioner rail, top guide, and chain were noticeably worn. The old chain was about 6mm longer than the new one. Maybe a little more....and the tensioner guide was noticeably worn in. Not horribly, but worn. The tensioner was almost all the way to the last ratchet grove as well, now it is seated maybe one click out. The pics of the cams make it look a little off but they are straight up....as they were when I took it apart this morning.


__________________________________________________
1972 BMW 3.0CSL, 1985 BMW Dinan 535i, 2001 Honda XR400R (plated), 1985 K100RT, 2004 ZX3 Focus, 1991 Dodge Power Wagon 4x4. 1977 Plymouth Trailduster 35K original miles!
    

12Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Mon May 16, 2016 5:26 pm

charlie99

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good work

have fun


__________________________________________________
cheezy grin whilst riding, kinda bloke ....oh the joy !!!! ...... ( brick aviator )

'86 K100 RT..#0090401 ..."Gerty" ( Gertrude Von Clickandshift ) --------O%O
    

13Back to top Go down    Before I put it all back together..... on Mon May 16, 2016 8:46 pm

SniperX

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From those of you who have done this before. Does this all look right timing wise? The manual is VERY vauge about the timing marks on the case for the crank, as well the pictures in it are very unclear to be honest.


__________________________________________________
1972 BMW 3.0CSL, 1985 BMW Dinan 535i, 2001 Honda XR400R (plated), 1985 K100RT, 2004 ZX3 Focus, 1991 Dodge Power Wagon 4x4. 1977 Plymouth Trailduster 35K original miles!
    

14Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Tue May 17, 2016 1:41 am

RicK G

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That looks OK although the exhaust is leading a bit (4°) but I don't think it could be changed to be any better.


__________________________________________________
If everything seems under control then you aint goin fast enough:- Mario Andretti
Bikes 1986 K100RT, 1993 K1100 LT, 1994 K1100 LT, 1993 K75 RT, 1996 K75RT, 1986 K75 GS, 1979 Z1300 Kawasaki X 2 & 1976 SR 500 Yamaha for now
    

15Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Tue May 17, 2016 3:22 am

SniperX

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@RicK G wrote:That looks OK although the exhaust is leading a bit (4°) but I don't think it could be changed to be any better.
These pics make it look a tad bit worse than it actually is, but I noticed that when I took it apart. You'll noticew my little scribe marks show it was off a tad when it was marked when I took it apart. It ran great before aside from the chain noise at start up.


__________________________________________________
1972 BMW 3.0CSL, 1985 BMW Dinan 535i, 2001 Honda XR400R (plated), 1985 K100RT, 2004 ZX3 Focus, 1991 Dodge Power Wagon 4x4. 1977 Plymouth Trailduster 35K original miles!
    

16Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Tue May 17, 2016 6:43 am

RicK G

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I have rarely seen any engine that comes up spot on with the cam timing. I have at times messed about with swaping or turning the sprockets the other way out to get the timing closer. Even if the inlet can ends up a touch advanced is better than the exhaust being retarded. Also I reckon that reversing the sprockets will extend the life of a second chain because there is a good fit to the sprocket rather than the slightly worn side where the chain ran previously. Be careful because I have seen the locating pegs anything up to 1/2 a tooth out.


__________________________________________________
If everything seems under control then you aint goin fast enough:- Mario Andretti
Bikes 1986 K100RT, 1993 K1100 LT, 1994 K1100 LT, 1993 K75 RT, 1996 K75RT, 1986 K75 GS, 1979 Z1300 Kawasaki X 2 & 1976 SR 500 Yamaha for now
    

17Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Tue May 17, 2016 8:22 pm

SniperX

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Before replacing the components, I brought the engine to tdc and marked those sprocket indicators. As far as it looks after replacement they are back to where they were within less than a degree.


__________________________________________________
1972 BMW 3.0CSL, 1985 BMW Dinan 535i, 2001 Honda XR400R (plated), 1985 K100RT, 2004 ZX3 Focus, 1991 Dodge Power Wagon 4x4. 1977 Plymouth Trailduster 35K original miles!
    

18Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Wed May 18, 2016 1:06 am

Holister

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It's possible to remove the timing chain off the sprockets by just losening them enough to slide the chain out from between the sprocket and engine casing. 
The sprockets can only position on the shaft in one position relatively. There's no adjustment a few degrees either way. What is important is that your camshafts don't move at all and at TDC that's unlikely.

I found it all to be a be a bit fool proof except for managing the tensioning mechanism back in correctly.


__________________________________________________
1988 K100RT     VIN No.  0094680
1989 K100RT     VIN No.  0097367 (naked)  
1996 K1100RS   VIN No.  0451808
     Fuel:  95 Octane
Engine Oil: Nulon Full Synthetic 15W50
Gear Box Oil:  Nulon Synthetic 75W90
    

19Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Wed May 18, 2016 2:25 am

SniperX

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Good! Then I guess I'll slap it back together tomorrow and fire it up.


__________________________________________________
1972 BMW 3.0CSL, 1985 BMW Dinan 535i, 2001 Honda XR400R (plated), 1985 K100RT, 2004 ZX3 Focus, 1991 Dodge Power Wagon 4x4. 1977 Plymouth Trailduster 35K original miles!
    

20Back to top Go down    put it back together today on Mon May 23, 2016 2:53 am

SniperX

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It fired right up as if it ran a few hours ago. I am very happy that I can now get some sleep!

I now just have to mess about topping fluids for the rad and maybe a tad bit of oil and I'll go for a much needed and wanted shake down ride. THANKS ALL for all the help and advise! I could NOT have done this without all of you!!!

Many thanks you are a lot of brilliant blokes!

Kev


__________________________________________________
1972 BMW 3.0CSL, 1985 BMW Dinan 535i, 2001 Honda XR400R (plated), 1985 K100RT, 2004 ZX3 Focus, 1991 Dodge Power Wagon 4x4. 1977 Plymouth Trailduster 35K original miles!
    

21Back to top Go down    Re: timing case removal on Mon Oct 10, 2016 7:05 am

SniperX

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Close to 5 months on and still running as if new!


__________________________________________________
1972 BMW 3.0CSL, 1985 BMW Dinan 535i, 2001 Honda XR400R (plated), 1985 K100RT, 2004 ZX3 Focus, 1991 Dodge Power Wagon 4x4. 1977 Plymouth Trailduster 35K original miles!
    

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