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1Back to top Go down    New Member on Wed Jul 19, 2017 4:02 am

mmart007

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Hi All,

Got muy hand on a 1987 K100RS with 21K miles that was sitting in a garage for almost 20 years. Those of you that have resurrected an older bike probably know what Ive been faced with from the disintegration of all things rubber in the gas tank, and bad fuel throughout the entire system, clogged injectors, dry rotted rubber hoses and much more. this bike is in prefect shape which made the challenge worth while however the timing of this project coincided with the summer months in the Las Vegas summer and it made the work in the garage unbearable so.........the bike is now sitting in my kitchen..LOL

Ive been working almost non-stop for the last 4 weeks and I finally got it all back together last night for its maiden run which went almost perfectly with a couple of issues. the fan self-destructed after 30 minutes even after I purposely checked it before putting the fairing back on and the speedo is action a bit bizarre which is why I'm on here tonight as I spotted this software that can emulate the pulse to the speedometer to calibrate it. Now Im trying too get my hands on this software so I can fix the speedo and fab now that the bike is back in the kitchen with the radiator out and the fan motor on order.

Sorry for the diary but when you live alone, sometime a guy just need to tell someone about his project trials and tribulations..Smile

Mark

    

2Back to top Go down    Re: New Member on Wed Jul 19, 2017 5:35 am

92KK 84WW Olaf

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Brilliant buy and hope all will be good. Yes we know exactly what is was like and you should know there are lots on the forum who live alone and we get some wonderful posts of their Ks and some more from the inevitable meet ups. So keep posting.

Speedo drive sensor is on rear final drive just behind the shock mounting, can be unscrewed and cleaned just wipe clean, also the connector on the other end is on the right under the seat near the back of the gas tank and is accessible for a clean up. Unfortunately the speedos do go a bit funny and you could also clean the pins etc where the big plug goes into the back of the unit. Removal is actually quite easy but watch, its HEAVY!

Not sure how many of the rubbers etc you have done but a good idea is start a thread for your K and put it into it. Then others will add answers to whatever you want or links if its already been done so you can have all the info together.


__________________________________________________
1992 K100LT 0193214 101,000 miles
1984 K100RT 0022575 Baja Red bought 36,000 now 87,100 miles
1997 K1100LT 58,000 miles
    

3Back to top Go down    Re: New Member on Thu Jul 20, 2017 3:48 pm

Born Again Eccentric

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mmart007 wrote:Ive been working almost non-stop for the last 4 weeks and I finally got it all back together last night for its maiden run which went almost perfectly with a couple of issues. the fan self-destructed after 30 minutes even after I purposely checked it before putting the fairing back on and the speedo is action a bit bizarre which is why I'm on here tonight as I spotted this software that can emulate the pulse to the speedometer to calibrate it. Now Im trying too get my hands on this software so I can fix the speedo and fab now that the bike is back in the kitchen with the radiator out and the fan motor on order.

Sorry for the diary but when you live alone, sometime a guy just need to tell someone about his project trials and tribulations..Smile
Welcome along Mark,

What a pain having the fan fail so soon after the rebuild - very frustrating!

Good advice from Olaf - if it is acting bizarrely then it is likely to be a dirty connection rather than just needing calibration. If it was the calibration being off, it would be holding steady but reading either too high (usual) or too low when compared with, say a GPS speed indication. If you are looking for the software - type "karamba" into the search box on the portal page and that should lead you to it. Dead easy to do the check with the cluster still on the bike and a PC creating the speed signal through the sensor cable. If you need to make adjustments, then it is a bit of open cluster surgery to be able to get at the little adjustment potentiometer - it wasn't located to make it easy to adjust, but not a difficult job do.

Enjoy


__________________________________________________

Paul

"Heidi" K100LT 1991 (Grey) (VIN 0190172 Engine No. 104EB 2590 2213) - 5th owner. January 2014 (34,000 - 61,000 miles and counting....)
"Gretel" K100LT 1989 (Silver Grey) (VIN 0177324 Engine No. 104EA 2789 2211) - 4th+ owner. September 2015 (58,500miles and counting....). Cat C Insurancewrite-off rebuild Feb 17
"Donor" K100LT 1990 (Red) (VIN 0178091 Engine No. 4489 2024) - 6th & final owner (crash write-off now donor bike). June 2012 (73,000 miles) to November 2013 (89,500 miles)
    

4Back to top Go down    Update..... on Thu Jul 20, 2017 5:01 pm

mmart007

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Born Again Eccentric wrote:
mmart007 wrote:Ive been working almost non-stop for the last 4 weeks and I finally got it all back together last night for its maiden run which went almost perfectly with a couple of issues. the fan self-destructed after 30 minutes even after I purposely checked it before putting the fairing back on and the speedo is action a bit bizarre which is why I'm on here tonight as I spotted this software that can emulate the pulse to the speedometer to calibrate it. Now Im trying too get my hands on this software so I can fix the speedo and fab now that the bike is back in the kitchen with the radiator out and the fan motor on order.

Sorry for the diary but when you live alone, sometime a guy just need to tell someone about his project trials and tribulations..Smile
Welcome along Mark,

What a pain having the fan fail so soon after the rebuild - very frustrating!

Good advice from Olaf - if it is acting bizarrely then it is likely to be a dirty connection rather than just needing calibration. If it was the calibration being off, it would be holding steady but reading either too high (usual) or too low when compared with, say a GPS speed indication. If you are looking for the software - type "karamba" into the search box on the portal page and that should lead you to it. Dead easy to do the check with the cluster still on the bike and a PC creating the speed signal through the sensor cable. If you need to make adjustments, then it is a bit of open cluster surgery to be able to get at the little adjustment potentiometer - it wasn't located to make it easy to adjust, but not a difficult job do.

Enjoy
Thanks for taking the time to respond, its nice to know there are folks out there willing to offer input.

The fan:
totally toast! Motor arrived today and I just took a break after installing the air box and installing the new fan to the radiator. figured that as long as I had the radiator out, I wold replace the fuel return line from the regulator to the tank as its suspect but require the airbag to be removed which was a bit of a test of patience and did in fact require some choice word and I think I even made up some new phrases while installing the airflow meter back into the air box but I digress...

The speedometer: the symptoms were a bit bizarre in that the speedo was intermittently registering a fluctuating speed while idling and when I was on my maiden ride (prior to fan melt-down), the speed indicated didn't seem correct. So, with that said, I needed to flush out the culprit which was why I wanted to test the system complete as the connecter by the battery to see if I had a rear pickup sensor issue, harness issue or speedometer cluster issue. There was also another thing that was troubling me was that I read somewhere that a 60Hz single in close proximity to the speedometer wold cause the speedometer to register a value and since I added a USB charger device to bike that also has a voltage readout, I was wondering if this new device was emitting a frequency thus causing the speedometer to register a value when idling. Anyhow, I tested the speedo with the Karamba software and with the circumference of my rear tire accurately measured and input in to the dashboard of the Karmaba software, I noticed that my speedo was working fine but no accurate. I then set out to adjust the speedo to where the rate of discrepancy was a bit more at 140mph than at 30mph so I focused on the legal speed limits 20-30-40-60 80 etc and dialed the speedo in to where I was happy.

Now that Ive written a book here, I'm going to get back to the re-assmbly and with any luck, I will be able to fire up this old girl today...

Thanks again for the response!!

    

5Back to top Go down    Re: New Member on Fri Jul 21, 2017 12:52 pm

Born Again Eccentric

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mmart007 wrote:There was also another thing that was troubling me was that I read somewhere that a 60Hz single in close proximity to the speedometer wold cause the speedometer to register a value and since I added a USB charger device to bike that also has a voltage readout, I was wondering if this new device was emitting a frequency thus causing the speedometer to register a value when idling.... I noticed that my speedo was working fine but no accurate. I then set out to adjust the speedo to where the rate of discrepancy was a bit more at 140mph than at 30mph so I focused on the legal speed limits 20-30-40-60 80 etc and dialed the speedo in to where I was happy...
It is possible to get electrical interference from an AC (Alternating Current) supply and this could lead to false readings (electrical noise) on sensitive instruments, especially where the instrument signal is very small in the first place. Usually, sensitive instruments and their sensor cables are suitably screened to prevent the electrical noise being detected (often the screen is something as simple as the wire braiding around the cable - like the stuff you will routinely see on TV coaxial cables).

However, in your case - you don't normally have a source of AC on your bike (unless you have done something like adding a DC to AC convertor) - the bike electrical power is DC (Direct Current) which is effectively a reasonably smooth, constant +12 V supply rather than AC where the voltage follows a sinusoidal waveform with each cycle being repeated at a set frequency (60Hz = 60 voltage cycles every second). Normal USA domestic electric supply is provided at 110V and 60Hz (as opposed to UK where it is 240V and 50Hz). I suspect your USB device has both DC input and output - so shouldn't be causing any interference with your speedo at all.

If you have run the karamba software to calibrate your speedo and the speedo has read steady at each speed increment, that suggests that the speedo is OK and the wiring from the connector (RHS of bike behind side panel) is also good. That says to me that the issue is rooted somewhere in the cabling back to the speed sensor, the connector plug (that you will have disconnected to input the karamba signal) or the speed sensor itself. Type "speed sensor" into the portal search box to see if you can get some more info on removing this sensor without trashing it.

When I calibrated my speedos I also found that there was a greater discrepancy at the top of the speed range, so did the same as you to set the speedo accurately in the 20 - 70mpg range. I figured that, if I could ever got the old girl up to 160mph (indicated) I probably wouldn't be wondering if I was really going that fast or if it was just a little less - and I'd keeping a really good look out for trouble ahead instead!


__________________________________________________

Paul

"Heidi" K100LT 1991 (Grey) (VIN 0190172 Engine No. 104EB 2590 2213) - 5th owner. January 2014 (34,000 - 61,000 miles and counting....)
"Gretel" K100LT 1989 (Silver Grey) (VIN 0177324 Engine No. 104EA 2789 2211) - 4th+ owner. September 2015 (58,500miles and counting....). Cat C Insurancewrite-off rebuild Feb 17
"Donor" K100LT 1990 (Red) (VIN 0178091 Engine No. 4489 2024) - 6th & final owner (crash write-off now donor bike). June 2012 (73,000 miles) to November 2013 (89,500 miles)
    

6Back to top Go down    Re: New Member on Fri Jul 21, 2017 2:37 pm

mmart007

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Born Again Eccentric wrote:
mmart007 wrote:There was also another thing that was troubling me was that I read somewhere that a 60Hz single in close proximity to the speedometer wold cause the speedometer to register a value and since I added a USB charger device to bike that also has a voltage readout, I was wondering if this new device was emitting a frequency thus causing the speedometer to register a value when idling.... I noticed that my speedo was working fine but no accurate. I then set out to adjust the speedo to where the rate of discrepancy was a bit more at 140mph than at 30mph so I focused on the legal speed limits 20-30-40-60 80 etc and dialed the speedo in to where I was happy...
It is possible to get electrical interference from an AC (Alternating Current) supply and this could lead to false readings (electrical noise) on sensitive instruments, especially where the instrument signal is very small in the first place. Usually, sensitive instruments and their sensor cables are suitably screened to prevent the electrical noise being detected (often the screen is something as simple as the wire braiding around the cable - like the stuff you will routinely see on TV coaxial cables).

However, in your case - you don't normally have a source of AC on your bike (unless you have done something like adding a DC to AC convertor) - the bike electrical power is DC (Direct Current) which is effectively a reasonably smooth, constant +12 V supply rather than AC where the voltage follows a sinusoidal waveform with each cycle being repeated at a set frequency (60Hz = 60 voltage cycles every second). Normal USA domestic electric supply is provided at 110V and 60Hz (as opposed to UK where it is 240V and 50Hz). I suspect your USB device has both DC input and output - so shouldn't be causing any interference with your speedo at all.

If you have run the karamba software to calibrate your speedo and the speedo has read steady at each speed increment, that suggests that the speedo is OK and the wiring from the connector (RHS of bike behind side panel) is also good. That says to me that the issue is rooted somewhere in the cabling back to the speed sensor, the connector plug (that you will have disconnected to input the karamba signal) or the speed sensor itself. Type "speed sensor" into the portal search box to see if you can get some more info on removing this sensor without trashing it.

When I calibrated my speedos I also found that there was a greater discrepancy at the top of the speed range, so did the same as you to set the speedo accurately in the 20 - 70mpg range. I figured that, if I could ever got the old girl up to 160mph (indicated) I probably wouldn't be wondering if I was really going that fast or if it was just a little less - and I'd keeping a really good look out for trouble ahead instead!

The bike is back together and I road tested it late last night and the fan worked flawlessly as well as the speedometer. My guess is that there was a dirty contact somewhere from the front console to the back sensor which were all touched during this last exercise. To your point about the pickup sensor, I can certainly see how this sensor can be destroyed during the removal process especially on older bikes like mine where things are stuck and or seized. Understanding how the sensor is constructed and the method of sealing within its mount provides insight as to how to remove it which went just fine. I was expecting to see a build-up on this sensor but the sensor was clear of any residue. The original symptoms were that speedometer was indicating an intermittent and fluctuating value which indicated to me that the speedometer was sensing pulses from somewhere other than the pick-up sensor and this had me scratching my head. This Mic Tuning USB charger I installed in the bike was carefully done with an additional shielded harness added from the heated handlebar circuit connector under the tank. This device also has a voltmeter built in which was purposely sought after to provide a visual instead of the "idiot" light on the instrument cluster. when this device arrived, I quickly noticed that this device was "made in China" and now I was suspicious as to what parts were used to comprise the circuit that displayed the volts and was it possible that this circuit was creating a frequency that the speedometer was interpreting as a pulse from the pickup sensor. All this has been proven negative but this was where my head was at initially when I first experienced the intermittent symptom. While I don't necessarily believe that thinks work magically, I do think certain things are amazing in how that work but they are all explainable and this is no exception and it needed to be flushed out so to avoid flaky problems that will plague me or the next owner of this bike.

    

7Back to top Go down    Re: New Member on Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:05 pm

jahearne

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Aright! Another RS! I just started my adventure and have yet to work on it, so I got nothing!


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- John
    

8Back to top Go down    Re: New Member on Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:19 pm

JR_K100RS

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G'day Mark , well done on the pick up from another 87 KRS owner , keep up the good work , post some pic's , we like pictures here

John Re

Melbourne Australia


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Diamond Grey ( 617 ) 1987 K100RS ( European Delivery ) Original owner
    

9Back to top Go down    Re: New Member on Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:59 pm

duck

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The Karumba software works (if you have a powerful enough sound card in your PC) but an alternative method of speedo calibration is to pull the sensor out and put a soldering iron close to it as many soldering irons emit a nice 60Hz magnetic field.

http://www.kbikeparts.com/classickbikes.com/ckb.tech/0.ckb.tech.files/speedocal/speedocal.htm


__________________________________________________
Current stable:
86 Custom K100 (standard fairing, K75 Belly pan, Ceramic chromed engine covers, paralever)
K75 Frankenbrick (Paralever, K11 front end, hybrid ABS, K1100RS fairing, radial tires)
86 K75C Turbo w/ paralever
94 K1100RS
93 K1100LT (x2)
91 K1
93 K75S (K11 front end)
91 K75S
14 Yamaha WR250R
http://www.ClassicKBikes.com
    

10Back to top Go down    Re: New Member on Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:54 am

indian036

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duck wrote:The Karumba software works (if you have a powerful enough sound card in your PC) but an alternative method of speedo calibration is to pull the sensor out and put a soldering iron close to it as many soldering irons emit a nice 60Hz magnetic field.
Or 50Hz if you live in a 230/240V place like Oz or Europe. (OP is in US, but others who take advantage of the advice may not be.Smile)

Bill


__________________________________________________
1985 K100RT Red. VIN 0028991K100RT ENG 104EA248523386
1985 K100RT Blue. VIN 0029036K100RT ENG 104EA25852071
1990 K100LT Black. VIN WB105060310190452
1984 K100RT White. VIN. 0023022K100RT ENG 104EA32848523
    

11Back to top Go down    Re: New Member on Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:07 pm

Born Again Eccentric

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indian036 wrote:
duck wrote:The Karumba software works (if you have a powerful enough sound card in your PC) but an alternative method of speedo calibration is to pull the sensor out and put a soldering iron close to it as many soldering irons emit a nice 60Hz magnetic field.
Or 50Hz if you live in a 230/240V place like Oz or Europe. (OP is in US, but others who take advantage of the advice may not be.Smile)

Bill
Or, if like me you have a gas powered soldering iron, you'll get no Hertz at all unless you touch the tip of the iron and then plenty of hurts in all the wrong places.


__________________________________________________

Paul

"Heidi" K100LT 1991 (Grey) (VIN 0190172 Engine No. 104EB 2590 2213) - 5th owner. January 2014 (34,000 - 61,000 miles and counting....)
"Gretel" K100LT 1989 (Silver Grey) (VIN 0177324 Engine No. 104EA 2789 2211) - 4th+ owner. September 2015 (58,500miles and counting....). Cat C Insurancewrite-off rebuild Feb 17
"Donor" K100LT 1990 (Red) (VIN 0178091 Engine No. 4489 2024) - 6th & final owner (crash write-off now donor bike). June 2012 (73,000 miles) to November 2013 (89,500 miles)
    

12Back to top Go down    Re: New Member on Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:36 pm

mmart007

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Born Again Eccentric wrote:
indian036 wrote:
duck wrote:The Karumba software works (if you have a powerful enough sound card in your PC) but an alternative method of speedo calibration is to pull the sensor out and put a soldering iron close to it as many soldering irons emit a nice 60Hz magnetic field.
Or 50Hz if you live in a 230/240V place like Oz or Europe. (OP is in US, but others who take advantage of the advice may not be.Smile)

Bill
Or, if like me you have a gas powered soldering iron, you'll get no Hertz at all unless you touch the tip of the iron and then plenty of hurts in all the wrong places.
I too used my gas soldering iron to create the harness for my USB charger extended from the heated handlebar circuit connecter under the tank. Although I didnt burn myself, I can tell stories of burning of other things including flesh with that butane powered soldering iron when it accidentally rolls and the exhaust ports begin creating thermal meltdown of whatever that soldering iron comes in contact with until I notice what has occurred and of course a few choice words are necessary as you can imagine........

    

13Back to top Go down    Re: New Member on Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:46 pm

mmart007

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jahearne wrote:Aright! Another RS! I just started my adventure and have yet to work on it, so I got nothing!
I just dug in and began mine not realizing that the project wold take be deeper and deeper and deeper......I have no regrets and in fact it was a great way to learn all about the bike's systems so now there isn't too much that I wont be able to diagnose if an unfortunate issue is to arise. I'm not completely done however the bike is road worthy now and I will perform some detailing of the aluminum housing as time goes on so make the bike even closer to showroom quality.

So.....dig in!!

Mark

    

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