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1Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Headlight upgrade experiences on Tue Dec 08, 2009 3:48 am

Comberjohn

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Now the days are shorter I am looking at upgrading my headlight on the LT. I have got as far as buying the relays and heavier cables and even done a bit of soldering on of connectors. I had planned on using 80/100w Xenon bulbs for a, hopefully, big increase in light output.
Incidently, despite being widely available, bulbs larger than the standard 55/60w cannot be legally used in the UK. Ho hum.
My problem is that the child bride has offered to get me a HID conversion for Christmas and I'm not sure whether to get that and stop asking her for a new K1300GT!
I know that the H4 conversion uses a cover in the bulb which is moved by a relay. Known as a Xenon Hi/Lo type bulb.
What are other members experiances with HID conversions compared to higher watts and relays?

http://www.johnsdrivingschool.co
    

2Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Tue Dec 08, 2009 3:19 pm

K-BIKE

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Hi,
I suspect the HID conversion will be illegal too as the reflector was not designed for HID. Check if the headlight is well aligned there will be little chance of being picked up by the tax collectors if it is but with any older vehicle plus HID the light colour alone says "pick me, pick me" :-(

Regards,
K-BIKE



Last edited by K-BIKE on Wed Dec 09, 2009 2:54 pm; edited 1 time in total

    

3Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Dec 09, 2009 12:48 am

green cat

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Here in France it's illegal. I use to use a 100 w bulb (illegal too) and now a Philips Xtrem power... it's quite better!!!


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[img]Headlight upgrade experiences 3cc2228804714fdc8e93fe1f84a93706 [/img][img]Headlight upgrade experiences K1100l10
    

4Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Dec 09, 2009 3:40 am

Comberjohn

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K-BIKE's comments about reflectors and lens caused me to do a bit more research. According to an official Department of Transport website, it's illegal to use an HID bulb with anything other than a headlight unit designed for HID. End of story.
In fact, on a car for the UK market it must also have a headlight washer fitted.
I know keeping within the law is sometimes regarded as being boring by some of our more rebellious brethen, but I can't be bothered with the hassle it could attract. Some of the write ups about the hi/lo H4 bulbs used for HID are less than impressive.
Our annual MOT test is conducted in government test centres in N Ireland and I could see me having to change it back to halogen just for the test every year.
Think I'll continue with the relays and try the Philips Xtrem bulb that green cat recommended.
Now, if I could only talk her into buying me that K1300GT instead.

http://www.johnsdrivingschool.co
    

5Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Dec 09, 2009 2:56 pm

K-BIKE

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Slow and steady is the way to get these things a little information now and again about the safety benefits the extra comfortable ride the reliability etc will eventually have her saying "You should get one"
Regards,
K-BIKE

    

6Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Thu Dec 10, 2009 8:24 pm

phil_mars

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I have to say I have heard some good reports on the PIAA kits which are relatively unobtrusive and should be easy to mount on the LT although not cheap by any means.

As for the K1300 reports from other forums are not as flattering and while most owners seem to love them they appear to have some fairly serious problems which don't get addressed which for what should be the best bike money can buy is disappointing to say the least.

So perhaps that will provide some solace if one does not turn up under the tree. Very Happy

Regards,

Phil

    

7Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:39 am

nino

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Hi, I replaced regular H 4, 60/55 watts with 80/100, (without relay on regular K 100 system). Much brighter light but I am a little bit worried about overheating.

Any advice, experience, reccomendations?

Regards

    

8Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:54 am

Inge K.

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Buy yourself a new dimmer switch to have as a spare (you`re gonna need it sooner or later).

Fried dimmer switches is a common problem on these models, even with the standard bulb.

My advice would be....pull the high power bulb, put it back when you have installed relays.


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Inge K.
K100RS -86. (first owner), K1100LTSE -94.
    

9Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:58 am

nino

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Tnx Inge, but what do you call dimmer (left or right switch)?

    

10Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:12 am

Inge K.

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LHS.


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Inge K.
K100RS -86. (first owner), K1100LTSE -94.
    

11Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:08 am

Tony Kirov

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I use HID bulb, but i don't like the light, may be because of color /6000k/
Low consumption, no heat, but the road looks wet at night :suspect:
I thing LED bulbs are legal, or just NOT illegal,
any experience with them?


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Headlight upgrade experiences 2854237993 BMW K100RS 4-VALVE (89V1) VIN#0205126 08/1991 ECE Headlight upgrade experiences 2854237993
    

12Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:13 am

sidecar paul

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I don't think you can get a 'dipping' headlamp LED........yet!

Paul.


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'84 K100RS (0014643) (owned since '85), 86 K100RS (0018891) with Martello sidecar (built as an outfit in '88),
'51 Vincent (since '67),'72 Montesa Cota (from new), '87 Honda RS125R NF4 (bought 2015) 
....No CARS never ever!
    

13Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:24 am

Motorandy123

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I found on another bike that HID was the perfect choice. I used a 35 watt 4300K light and it was close to stock color and about twice the light.

The big problem is the original stock HID's (on car's) had a leveler to dip the bulb when going uphill to avoid blinding people. My bike does that (blinds people) with the stock bulb when leaned over. Luckily here they don't worry about that here.

If they really wanted you to be safe they would require the original bulb light up the road sufficiently so you didn't have to look for a better setup...

    

14Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:28 am

92KK 84WW Olaf

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Dip switch....!! Left hand side.

Dip stick...for measuring the oil level. If you didnt have the window in the sump.

92KK


__________________________________________________
1992 K100LT 0193214 Bertha Alaska Blue 101,000 miles
1984 K100RT 0022575 Brutus Baja Red 578 bought 36,000 now 89,150 miles
1997 K1100LT 0188024 Wotan Mystic Red 689 58,645 now 102,50 miles
1983 K100RS 0011171 Fricka 606 29,495 miles Damn K Pox Its a Bat outta Hell No 34,600 miles
    

15Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty HID vs high wattage on Fri Sep 21, 2012 12:44 pm

Björn

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John,


I have HID in the cage - absolutely love it, much better vision than with halogen - but as you said only legal with lamp units designed for it i.e. projector lens, height adjustment and high-pressure wash. High wattage bulbs can stain and dim your reflector tain after a while Sad - that happened to my old man's car a while ago.

My experience is that any headlamp with clean plastic / glass (projector lens or free form reflector) gives much better light than the old parabolic with "ribbed" glass. Any aftermarket FF or projector type headlamp for her?

No experience with LED as yet.


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In Thór's name we hit..... the road.
Headlight upgrade experiences R120011
    

16Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Fri Sep 21, 2012 1:14 pm

BadjerJim

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@Motorandy123 wrote:I found on another bike that HID was the perfect choice. I used a 35 watt 4300K light and it was close to stock color and about twice the light.

The big problem is the original stock HID's (on car's) had a leveler to dip the bulb when going uphill to avoid blinding people. My bike does that (blinds people) with the stock bulb when leaned over. Luckily here they don't worry about that here...

Can you give us a source and part number? I'm interested to experiment with this. I'm sure others are too.

    

17Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Fri Sep 21, 2012 10:55 pm

Motorandy123

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You can buy them here;

http://www.vvme.com/hid-headlights/bi-xenon-hid-conversion-kit/h4-3-9003-bi-xenon-hid-kit/standard-h4-3-9003-bi-xenon-hid-kit

4300K is close to halogen. It's a kit for a car so you can do 2 bikes (though you need to supply your own relay for the second bike).

    

18Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:20 am

K-BIKE

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I have fitted extra bright 80/100W bulbs to the K and to both Merc's and the Volvo no issues with Warrant of Fitness because they are adjusted correctly so as to comply with the avoidance of dazzling other road users on dip BUT the output is much better on dipped and on main at night so well worth doing.

The other change I made on the K was to fit the Eastern Beaver ceramic bulb holder waterproof relay kit which uses the signal from the old bulb socket to fire the relays and has a heavy duty fused line direct from the battery it is a real plug and play installation with exceptionally high quality workmanship from Jim at Eastern Beaver that made a noticeable improvement in performance because of the voltage drop caused by the original wiring and switch and because of the switch in the grip only needing to switch/carry relay coil current they should last and last. You can build it yourself and I am more than able to do that but Jim's kit was brilliant and well worth the modest cost.
Regards,
K-BIKE

    

19Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty How about some Photos on Wed Mar 27, 2013 2:02 pm

ibjman

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I am about to embark on the trip into the fairing & wiring to install the EB kit & 80/100 Bulb.
Also installing some garbing outlets for the hot clothes and the aux fuse box from Centech.
On from there, a Hazard flasher switch and 2 other dash switches for Misc. Items.
I would love to see your photos of wiring installs, relay & fuse box mountings so I have ideas on how to do it tidy like.
Some people are so talented in making beautiful installs.
I can "fix" but I don't "make" very well

    

20Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Does this look acceptable on Thu Mar 28, 2013 11:20 am

ibjman

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Here's a sketch of my tentative plan to mount my EB headlight relays & Centech fuse panel.
Rationale is to mount an Aluminum plate on the 'flat" side of the right part of the fairing bracket. It will allow me to run all the wiring along the front side of the fairing bracket & down to the steering head area so the wires can be routed under the tank and forward to the headlamp. Easy access by removing the 3 screws and pulling the right side tank/fairing filler panel. It would allow me to remove the fairing at for service without disturbing the electrics.
What do You all think????
Headlight upgrade experiences Mount_10

    

21Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Thu Mar 28, 2013 12:20 pm

RicK G

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That would do the job does it give room for you to get the headlight bulb out without removing the fairing. I wont say easily because that term should never be used in the same sentence as K headlight bulb.


__________________________________________________
"Man sacrifices his health in order to make money.
Then he sacrifices money to recuperate his health.
And then he is so anxious about the future that he does not enjoy the present; the result being that he does not live in the present or the future; he lives as if he is never going to die, and then dies having never really lived."   Dalai Lama


Bikes 1993 K1100 LT, 1998 K1100 LT, 1993 K75 RT, 1996 K75RT, 1986 K75 GS, 1979 Z1300 Kawasaki X 2 for now
    

22Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Yes, I think so on Thu Mar 28, 2013 12:51 pm

ibjman

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I expect I could remove the bulb from the left side

    

23Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Thu Mar 28, 2013 6:47 pm

Rendrag

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I dunno about the US, but over here, we have these +100% globes, which are bloody tops! I've ALWAYS run 90/130w globes in my cars and bikes (yes, always with a custom loom and relays), but in the K, i was blowing globes every 20-25 hours of riding. Which was getting painful a couple of years ago when i was commuting 150km each way to sydney to work every day. And that was about the time when the govt started cracking down on STORES selling these not-legal-for-street-use globes.. And the bloke behind the counter put me onto these +50 globes. They were a little lower brightness than the 90/130 globes, but hardly ever blew. Then the +80's came out. Bloody fab.

My current globe is a +100, and holy sheeeet, It is FANTASTIC. On the karuah ride, I had a couple of guys with newer HID-fitted bikes asking if I'd converted to HID.

if you have Narva in the US, I'd seriously recommend checking em out - it saves a bit of load on the alternator, and lots of heat in the lense!

Cheers,

DG


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2000 VFR800
    

24Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Thu Mar 28, 2013 9:02 pm

Crazy Frog

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I just finished installing relays in the fairing.
In total I have 5 relays installed on the fairing bracket.
I pickup the main power on the starter relay (The lead coming from the battery). It feeds a 5 fuses box installed on the outside of the electrical tray (opposite side of the original fuse box). 5 good size wires go to the main contact of each relay.
The positive of the relay's coil is fed from the parking light wire. (relays cannot work if the ignition is not turn ON).
To control the relays, I installed the switches on the negative side of the relays coil.

As I have 2 extra lights (a real fog light and a powerful driving light), I pickup the control in the electrical tray Smile . The round plug for auxiliary equipment is perfect for this type of application and for these 2 specific relays, they control the positive side of the coil. (No need to butcher the original loom of the bike).
It has one wire energized when you are on high beam (I believe it's the white one) and one energized when you are on low beam (I believe it's the yellow one).

My explanation is very confusing, but tonight I will make a schematic and post it with pictures. (I have to be ready to go to work).

Here is just the plug for special equipment in the eletcrical box:
Headlight upgrade experiences Se_con10

By the way, there is room for 2 extra relays in the electrical tray. This is for the auxiliary light kit from BMW)


CF


__________________________________________________
Headlight upgrade experiences Frog15Headlight upgrade experiences Logo2101986 k75, 1985 K100rt, 1985 K100rt/EML GT2 sidecar, 1999 K1200lt/Hannigan Astro Sport sidecar.
    

25Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Hmmmmm on Fri Mar 29, 2013 4:21 am

ibjman

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I'll have to take some time to dissect your instructions for method & reason.
I have yet to understand the objective.
I'm using the EB headlight relay kit w/the HD ceramic connector. For now, I'll guess you are using the Aux wiring connections..... in lieu of the EB plug to provide control circuits to the relays???????
Still not sure.

    

26Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Fri Mar 29, 2013 5:26 am

Themason

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I have been using 100/55 watt H-4 bulbs on twins with the big 8-inch Bosch headlight and K100s for thirty years with no extra relays or anything else and never had a problem. I use the high beam a [i]lot [/i]out in the desert and never had a problem with heat. Those extra relays are a waste of money and effort.



I have measured, using roadside markers, the distance the stock headlight with a 100 watt high beam illuminates and it is 4/10 of a mile. You almost cannot overdrive this headlight on a straight flat road. I have 100/80 watt H-4 bulbs in my Audi and it doesn't illuminate the road as well as the K bike headlight does. I paid a bunch of money for those European headlights too! At least they are better than the OEM US-spec things.



Once in a while it is useful to remove the headlight assembly (I know, not easy on a faired K bike), disassemble the lense from the reflector and clean everything. It makes a remarkable difference in headlight brightness. If the fairing is ever off for any reason (oh no, we never crash or tip our bikes over, nope, never happens, lol) take the extra time to clean out that headlight assembly.


__________________________________________________
I live in a parallel universe but have a vacation home in reality :arrow:

1984 K-100RS Alaska Blue w/Parelever and 16V wheels.

1984 K-100RS Metallic Madison stock

1986 R-80G/S w/1000 cc engine

2007 Harley Davidson Street Rod Mirage Orange w/XR1200 wheels, Race Tech, True Track, Works Performance shocks

2007 Harley Davidson Street Rod Vivid Black stock

1993-ish K-100/1100RT/LT hemaphrodite frankenbike thingy to be painted satin black from a rattle can eventually
    

27Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Thanks for the tip(s) on Fri Mar 29, 2013 6:09 am

ibjman

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I appreciate your contribution.
I have found that many users have experienced completely different scenarios.
One of the very senior and knowledgeable contributors on the forum (Inge) is considered to be almost GODLIKE with his expertise on these bikes. He is the unequivocal go to guy here when a question needs to be answered (sorry, Crazyfrog).
His experience shows that there is still valid reasons to use the relays.
#1 seems to be that the arguably light duty contacts in the headlight switch can not always carry enough current to supply full system voltage to the lamp hence the bulb does not glow as brightly as it should.
#2 (especially) high wattage bulbs create extra draw that has the capability to melt the plastic around the switch contacts and cause an outage.
#3 Again the higher wattage of an oversized bulb has the possibility of melting the plastic wiring connector at the lamp. The Eastern Beaver kit offers a ceramic insert connector to prevent that failure.
I am happy that you have excellent light and have never had an outage in motion.
I, however have experienced a complete failure of the headlamp while switching to Hi Beam on a twisty mountain road in a pitch black night due to an intermittent switch and I do not want to ever have that occur again. Even a momentary loss of illumination in a turn at 80 mph scares me.
Thanks again for contributing to the forum.
I am cleaning my reflector as we speak. I would love to obtain a European square headlamp lens that has the different beam pattern characteristics.
I have yet to find a source.
Regards, ibj...

    

28Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Fri Mar 29, 2013 6:18 am

charlie99

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not at all hard to follow bert ...

more of less what i have done also


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'86 K100 RT..#0090401 ..."Gerty" ( Gertrude Von Clickandshift ) --------O%OHeadlight upgrade experiences Au-log10

'86 k100 rs.. #######..  "Fred " (f(rame) red ) ( Fredrick leichtundschnell ) - -
bits and pieces from many kind friends across the k100 world ...with many thanks ..
    

29Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Fri Mar 29, 2013 2:37 pm

Themason

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In more than three decades riding BMWs, and 28 plus years with my first K bike (the one in my avatar, the one I rode to work today). 291,000 original miles. I have never had any of the problems you mention. I lubricate the switches occasionally with WD-40 (exactly what it was designed for, during WWII for the US Navy) and that keeps the contacts corrosion free (which is the real enemy, not the current draw of those headlights) and thus cool. The original wires, headlight bucket and socket still do their job with no obvious damage other than a cracked outer heat shrink due to age hardening. I think people look for problems to "solve" sometimes. Makes for good reading on discussion boards, lol.
I'll bet the guy who RTV siliconed his K100RT clutch spring to the flywheel learned[i] that[/i] "technique on a discussion board too.


__________________________________________________
I live in a parallel universe but have a vacation home in reality :arrow:

1984 K-100RS Alaska Blue w/Parelever and 16V wheels.

1984 K-100RS Metallic Madison stock

1986 R-80G/S w/1000 cc engine

2007 Harley Davidson Street Rod Mirage Orange w/XR1200 wheels, Race Tech, True Track, Works Performance shocks

2007 Harley Davidson Street Rod Vivid Black stock

1993-ish K-100/1100RT/LT hemaphrodite frankenbike thingy to be painted satin black from a rattle can eventually
    

30Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Mason on Fri Mar 29, 2013 3:10 pm

ibjman

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I for one, fully understand that you have not encountered the various headlight circuit failures that a host of other members have had. (Perhaps because you are the only person who oils your switches with WD-40?)
I expect there may be others here that would agree with me that you have made your point that your machine(s) have not failed in this way as you have stated.
I would like to ask you to give the rest of us equal consideration here and consider the possibility as being true that the failures described by so many as to melted parts or poor connections may indeed be real and caused by some insufficiency in OEM design, perhaps validating the installation of the EB relays or other similar upgrade. That you have quoted to be unnecessary.
Most of us choose to use tried & true "De-oxit" instead of WD-40. Some feel that it is superior to WD40 in contact corrosion removal/prevention and that it adds suitable lubrication properties to switch surfaces while possibly being less detrimental to the plastic parts themselves.
We are here with the intention of "helping" one another.......not disputing others' intelligence.
Please go ahead & tell me if I am off base here but be considerate to all.
I am confident that everyone wants to respect your opinions & posts.
The forum administrators will point out to me if my direction here is mis guided.
What say Crazy?

    

31Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Fri Mar 29, 2013 11:08 pm

Crazy Frog

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@ibjman wrote:
I expect there may be others here that would agree with me that you have made your point that your machine(s) have not failed in this way as you have stated.
I would like to ask you to give the rest of us equal consideration here and consider the possibility as being true that the failures described by so many as to melted parts or poor connections may indeed be real and caused by some insufficiency in OEM design, perhaps validating the installation of the EB relays or other similar upgrade. That you have quoted to be unnecessary.
.
We are here with the intention of "helping" one another.......not disputing others' intelligence.
Please go ahead & tell me if I am off base here but be considerate to all.
I am confident that everyone wants to respect your opinions & posts.
The forum administrators will point out to me if my direction here is mis guided.
What say Crazy?

I am in total agreement with Ibjman.

The problem with the switches is real and many of us experienced it. Nobody enjoy taking the bike apart in the middle of the riding season just for fun.

Themason: I question your electrical ability.
The wiring of the K100 was NEVER designed to run a 100 Watts bulb. Furthermore, in most cases, the extra heat generated by the bulb will melt the original plastic headlight socket resulting to a fire hazard.
The hand switch contacts are not adequate to carry the load generated by the installation of a 100w bulb. They are barely good enough for the 50w bulb.

Calculation of the wire size is critical and when modifying a circuit, you must consider a safety margin. What if the battery voltage is low? Have you ever encounter a problem with the starter relay? Many of us had.
amps = watts / voltage + consideration of the length of the wire. (A wire is a resistor!)

To safely carry a load of 5 Amps (a 50 Watts bulb draw 4.2 Amps at 12v) the size of the wire should be 4mm² or 11 AWG.
If you install a 100W bulb (the draw will be 8,5 Amps at 12v) the size of the wire should be 6mm² or 9 AWG.

Here is a good site to be educated.

WD40 is a water repellent and does not prevent contacts to melt if they overheat.

Relays have been used for many years and their intended applications are exactly what members are trying to integrate to their original wiring. I would never suggest changing the bulb for one with higher wattage without the addition of a relay, the installation of bigger wires and the replacement of the headlight socket with a ceramic one. AND having the circuit fused protected.

If BMW had designed the perfect bike, we would not have the technical sections on this forum. To my opinion, the design of the electrical has big flaws.

Please consider others before posting a misleading opinions. We are working with facts. If one of us consider himself as an expert, his answer MUST be true with consideration of safety factors.

Here is what must be done to upgrade the original circuit in order to accommodate a more powerful bulb. Their is NO alternative without compromising the safety.

Headlight upgrade experiences Headlight-upgrade

CF


__________________________________________________
Headlight upgrade experiences Frog15Headlight upgrade experiences Logo2101986 k75, 1985 K100rt, 1985 K100rt/EML GT2 sidecar, 1999 K1200lt/Hannigan Astro Sport sidecar.
    

32Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Simple practical wiring on Sat Mar 30, 2013 2:06 am

Crazy Frog

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One of my previous post was confusing as I was talking about the installation of auxiliary lights. I just re-wired the original BMW auxiliary lights on the sidecar because the original wiring size was border line.

The mandate was:
- Using relays installed on the fairing bracket (no extra load on the handle bar switch).
- Able to ride without the auxiliary lights.
- When the auxiliary lights are ON:
* On low beam only the fog light works.
* On High beam, only the long range light works
- Not butchering the original bike wiring.
- System being fuse protected.
- Auxiliary lights working only when the ignition is ON. (achieved by using the parking light circuit to power the relay's coil)

In many countries, the functionality of automatically switching the long range light OFF when switching to low beam is mandatory.
You also don't want to have the long range light working with the fog light (This is not effective).

A fuse box is installed on the outside of the electrical tray.
The main power comes from the starter relay. (the main power lead from the battery originally goes to the starter relay and this is where you install an extra wire(s) to feed the fuse box).

I could have modified the circuit to include the load shed relay, but this is unnecessary as the lights could be turned off with the switch.

Headlight upgrade experiences Auxili10

The accessory plug doesn't reflect the reality. This was an error when I drew the schematic. The real connection for the high beam is the top left connection(under the letters cc of the word accessory).

Sorry about this

CF



Last edited by Crazy Frog on Sun Mar 31, 2013 12:41 pm; edited 2 times in total


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Headlight upgrade experiences Frog15Headlight upgrade experiences Logo2101986 k75, 1985 K100rt, 1985 K100rt/EML GT2 sidecar, 1999 K1200lt/Hannigan Astro Sport sidecar.
    

33Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:14 am

RicK G

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What you were saying about relays reminded me of a friend with a Z1300 like mine and when I told him to install relays for a better headlight and showed him how much mine had improved he went out and got the bits and did the job then some time later he said that it had made no difference at all. A few weeks later he came to my place and I checked things out, now with a word of a lie he had put the relay in circuit but had drawn the power for the headlight from the original wire that supplied it so he was no better off. Sometimes one forgets that your own knollege of a particular subject is not the normal and is in fact far above that which others have.


__________________________________________________
"Man sacrifices his health in order to make money.
Then he sacrifices money to recuperate his health.
And then he is so anxious about the future that he does not enjoy the present; the result being that he does not live in the present or the future; he lives as if he is never going to die, and then dies having never really lived."   Dalai Lama


Bikes 1993 K1100 LT, 1998 K1100 LT, 1993 K75 RT, 1996 K75RT, 1986 K75 GS, 1979 Z1300 Kawasaki X 2 for now
    

34Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Sat Mar 30, 2013 3:57 pm

Themason

Themason
Platinum member
Platinum member
You still don't understand. Clean, corrosion free contacts do not have heat problems, even with high wattage bulbs. Corrosion adds resistance, and heat. I use WD-40 to prevent the accumulation of corrosion and this prevents heat problems. It is not a fault of the design, it is due to a lack of effective maintenance combined with wet conditions. Deal with the corrosion and you don't need upgraded wiring and relays. A spritz of something like WD-40 on the contacts periodically and all the above discussion becomes moot.


__________________________________________________
I live in a parallel universe but have a vacation home in reality :arrow:

1984 K-100RS Alaska Blue w/Parelever and 16V wheels.

1984 K-100RS Metallic Madison stock

1986 R-80G/S w/1000 cc engine

2007 Harley Davidson Street Rod Mirage Orange w/XR1200 wheels, Race Tech, True Track, Works Performance shocks

2007 Harley Davidson Street Rod Vivid Black stock

1993-ish K-100/1100RT/LT hemaphrodite frankenbike thingy to be painted satin black from a rattle can eventually
    

35Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Some may beg to differ on Sat Mar 30, 2013 4:32 pm

ibjman

ibjman
Life time member
Life time member
The Mason
I'm not entirely convinced who may not understand here. To continue to be a member of this forum, you must allow others to have the same freedom of opinion that you have.
I'm sure most here, completely agree with your point that correctly maintained, cleaned and tightly connected contacts do not overheat when used as designed.
I will ask you to at least consider the point that we are trying to explain to you........that the original contacts, switches & wiring, while adequate for 55/65 watts, some of us wish to alter the original design by adding higher than designed wattage, accessories in this case for instance a 80/100 watt replacement globe.
Could you at least give us the benefit of the doubt here that there are some limits to the amount of current a specific size/duty switch/wire can adequately control? Exceed those parameters by more than a specific amount and the circuit will overheat at where ever the weakest transfer point happens to be???
At any rate, I will tell you that the "style" of your posts here rather intended or otherwise, appears to be at best "argumentative". People simply don't like to be told that they are stupid. And not everyone here is stupid.
I believe that you can learn to not post in an offensive manner if you wish to.
You generally seem to be a very educated fellow.
Please be kind and considerate in your words to others here.
If your intention is to be courteous and helpful......the world will welcome you with open arms.
If on the other hand, you wish to be argumentative, insulting and inflammatory, you will be encouraged to try to find a forum where such behavior is welcome.
Please heed the warning, before your machine goes "TILT" when you attempt to sign on here.
Regards, ibj...

    

36Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Sat Mar 30, 2013 6:34 pm

charlie99

charlie99
VIP
VIP
that last post from "the mason" is a doosey

i hope that at some time he can get some electrical experience in both the theory and practice

here is what i have noticed over the last 40 years in the electrical - electronics trades on contacts as far i have witnessed and understand it .

everytime that a switch contact is opened or closed ...with an inductive load on the other end of the circuit (read light globe in this case ) a small magnetic field is setup or colapses ...the process also causes some slight form of arcing as the flow of electrons ionises accross the contacts (quite often one can see a small spark occur ....the larger the current the larger the effect and the bigger the hole on the contacts .

typically when switching off that load is when the most damage is done as the ionisation and arcing process .(developed by a colapsing inductive field ie the light globe ) in dc theory this has no particular significance other than the right hand theoy of magnetic fields induced into the cable associated with the current flow ..

but in ac theory ...(which applies when you either create or diconnect an inductive ...or more precisly "reactive " circuit --just the frequency is particuarly low ) when you turn off the load a larger than normal spike is generated on the field colapse of the small circular winding of the actuall light fillament ....the common references in this are that the back emf (voltage spike ) can be up to 10 times the applied voltage ...ie 100 + volts but commonly a little less than that with just a globe on the end this is amplified with each amp of current accross the contact area .as the positive voltage has no where to go other than the still ionised arc accross that switch contact it will attempt to go to a source of equal or higher voltage ...now unavailable in the system ....thus pitting the contacts in the process a lubricant no matter what it is ...only restricts the area of ionisation ...a chemical cleaner- conduction additive provides a larger surface area and conduction path ,thus lower effect of the arcing pithole created

if "the masons " theory was to be believed ...no one ever would need to change a set of points in a standard "kettering" type ignition system ever !!!! sorry it aint going to happen . thats why we went electronic ...fit once never adjust till it breaks .... all the hard work is already designed with back emf protection and bypass circuitry in place .

by way of contrast kettering systems use rare metal contacts in a designed way to prolong the life of the contact points ...mostly paladium which a really quite arc resistant type of metal ...silver being the best conductor is not particualy suited to mechanical and electrical arcs etc ..and would deteriorate quite quickly, likewise relays ...well designed use these technologies to assist the logetivity of the function ...many folks are employed solely to replace relays in production shops of relay controlled equipment now a dieing career path except in extreeme circumstances and loads

our switch contacts are not designed or suited to high current field colapses ...and additionally are out in the open subject to additional contamination by dirt water and everything else that we pass through , the contact points are particualy small and the supporting brass is not designed well ...Being mounted in themoplastic ...omg !! ...as high resitstance and arced point contacts conduct less amperage effectivly with now more heat generated because of the growing resistance of the contacts ...whats going to happen ....heat distorted brass bits ...hardening plastic ...eventually till the switch fails ....many of us have chosen to install relays as a sacrificial load switching device ...often rated far better than the switch contacts that came out of the bmw factory ...shoot a relay cost just a few bucks to replace --source ...whereas combination switches cost a frigging fortune ...i feel much better that my combination switch is only switching the relay current of 20-50 milli amps .02 - .05 of an amp rather than 6.00 + amps

we have seen documented here that the actuall voltage getting to the globe before modificatiion was a lot lower than the applied voltage on the input of the circuit .... small wiring does have some blessings ...untill the insulation melts and cross couples with other wires under the tank or in the switch assembly ...also well documented in the forum .

i guess lots of us understand this process and take it as given ... some do not ...some just go on... with out concidering the likelyhood or reason

when i was a kid i thought i knew it all ....later in life i realize how much i still have to learn

i hope this helps in the debate somehow

Headlight upgrade experiences 483912_482302441823383_1429115930_n


__________________________________________________
cheezy grin whilst riding, kinda bloke ....oh the joy !!!! ...... ( brick aviator )

'86 K100 RT..#0090401 ..."Gerty" ( Gertrude Von Clickandshift ) --------O%OHeadlight upgrade experiences Au-log10

'86 k100 rs.. #######..  "Fred " (f(rame) red ) ( Fredrick leichtundschnell ) - -
bits and pieces from many kind friends across the k100 world ...with many thanks ..
    

37Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Sat Mar 30, 2013 8:02 pm

RicK G

RicK G
VIP
VIP
Thank you Charlie very well put but of course what we must remember here Charlie is that everybody is entitled to their own opinion but not to their own facts.


__________________________________________________
"Man sacrifices his health in order to make money.
Then he sacrifices money to recuperate his health.
And then he is so anxious about the future that he does not enjoy the present; the result being that he does not live in the present or the future; he lives as if he is never going to die, and then dies having never really lived."   Dalai Lama


Bikes 1993 K1100 LT, 1998 K1100 LT, 1993 K75 RT, 1996 K75RT, 1986 K75 GS, 1979 Z1300 Kawasaki X 2 for now
    

38Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:01 pm

AJ.Valente

AJ.Valente
Life time member
Life time member
Ditto on contact maintenance 99. When cleaning handlebar switches this winter I serviced each hinge with a tiny droplet of super oil, then worked the devices till they moved freely. The only thing sprayed in there was quick drying electrical cleaner. :suspect:

    

39Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:30 pm

charlie99

charlie99
VIP
VIP
a tiny squirt of oil product will certainly keep the plastic mechanism pliable at the hinged / mooving -sprung sections where they become quite stiff with age ,,,crikey i had devils own trouble getting the high -low switch going properly (had nothing to do with the switch contacts at all, more the plastic and spring mechanism corroding ) at that time i had not found lanotec


__________________________________________________
cheezy grin whilst riding, kinda bloke ....oh the joy !!!! ...... ( brick aviator )

'86 K100 RT..#0090401 ..."Gerty" ( Gertrude Von Clickandshift ) --------O%OHeadlight upgrade experiences Au-log10

'86 k100 rs.. #######..  "Fred " (f(rame) red ) ( Fredrick leichtundschnell ) - -
bits and pieces from many kind friends across the k100 world ...with many thanks ..
    

40Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Sun Mar 31, 2013 12:03 am

RicK G

RicK G
VIP
VIP
I have found with the hi/lo switch that when they get a bit of age they work well if you put a tiny and I mean tiny lead in to the detent. I use a very fine jewlers round file and make a slight depression where the detent slides onto the plastic and it makes the world of difference but BE CAREFUL it is easy to over do it and it slips back out of high beam.. No dont ask how I know but it made a wonderful source for spares.


__________________________________________________
"Man sacrifices his health in order to make money.
Then he sacrifices money to recuperate his health.
And then he is so anxious about the future that he does not enjoy the present; the result being that he does not live in the present or the future; he lives as if he is never going to die, and then dies having never really lived."   Dalai Lama


Bikes 1993 K1100 LT, 1998 K1100 LT, 1993 K75 RT, 1996 K75RT, 1986 K75 GS, 1979 Z1300 Kawasaki X 2 for now
    

41Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Sun Mar 31, 2013 10:10 am

K-BIKE

avatar
Life time member
Life time member
Plus one for all those above who have said the wiring and switches are undersized, I have said before and say again the wiring and switches on our bikes are undersized.

Let us deal with indisputable facts, filament light bulbs from the humble torch bulb up to the largest halogen headlight bulb all exhibit a high inrush current when first turned on that is because a cold lamp filament has a low resistance and when switched on from cold the inrush current is between 7 and 15 times the steady state current when hot which is a huge amount of inrush current. Anyone who has used semiconductors rated to switch the steady state current of a filament lamp soon has a forcible reminder of inrush current due to those characteristics when the semiconductor burns out especially when switching slow flashing light circuits, those being the most savage at destroying the fruits of one's semiconductor design efforts.

Believe it or not I suspect some vehicle manufacturers attempt to limit this inrush by using thin wiring to lighting circuits with the benefit of reduced amounts of copper = lower cost to them and reduced inrush due to higher resistance. Anyone who has looked with a knowledgeable eye at the wiring on our K's and indeed most vehicles will see the wiring is way too thin for the duty.

Take an accurate meter and measure the voltage on a car or motorcycle when running at normal average driving revs on the road and then whilst at those revs measure the voltage at the headlights when they are on, it is not unusual to find them running anywhere between 1 and 3 volts below the voltage at the battery all due to resistance in the wires and switches. Now take a look at the switches, the size of the contacts and the current conducting paths are minimal and not really up to the task of feeding standard lighting and definitely not up to the task of feeding uprated wattage lighting.

There is no substitute for adding relays to our lighting circuits
because even if we rewired all lighting wires to welding cable size the
BMW light switch contacts are too small for the duty. Use the existing
circuitry to drive a high current switching relay as excellently drawn
out by our esteemed leader and let the relay and high current cable
supplying the relay do the work of carrying the high inrush and high
wattage steady state current. If you are not up to Crazy Frog's level of
knowledge of all things electrical then buy the excellent Eastern
Beaver relay kit particularly with the ceramic bulb holder. Which ever
way you go you will thank CF or Jim at EB for the result, I know I did
and do every time I turn my lights on.

Regards,
K-BIKE

    

42Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Dec 24, 2014 12:54 am

Mark K Boy

Mark K Boy
Gold member
Gold member
Thanks to all for the above.....


This is tomorrows project for me.....Wire my two driving lights correctly.....

I will put in my two cents worth, I come from an electronics back ground........

I am a very big believer of keeping ALL switches and ALL connecting blocks well maintained.
I have just finished unplugging all connecting blocks and running a little tool I got for my Dremel (it has an abrasive tip, two sizes) down all the female connections with my fingertips with a twist, its a perfect loose fit.. I then use the same tool to scrape down the side of the male connectors. A small set of "Rat tail" files would work the same. (Be gentle).
I then use the contact cleaner as seen below and finish with a little CRC 5-56. I did pay for some very expensive contact grease, like a bulb grease but 100 times the cost, I did not use it as I was concerned that it may have some conductivity between the terminals within the blocks....... Thoughts ?
Headlight upgrade experiences C8aca4567cffd66a90ff38ab03732714 Headlight upgrade experiences 1289dd033b4652b82bb84a7a44d5399d

My bike is a few years younger than most others on the form (1993) however I have all the same problems,,, 

Crazy Frog - Thanks for the Wiring diagram and words on wire thickness, its what I came looking for. Post #32
Charlie99 - Thanks for the education and yes, I would like my switch to be smoother..... Post #36 / #39. I did read somewhere where a guy did some fine work to the switch to enable a smoother experience but can not find it again....

ibjman - #27 True all that - I was loosing my high beam upon switching when I first got the bike, not cool.
Themason - #26, cleaning the reflector, good advice.

If my connector block servicing technique is flawed please let me know.

Once again, thanks, I am now confident armed with my new relays/fuses/isolation switch and appropriate cabling that I will get the job done right.

Merry Christmas ! (Are we aloud to say that anymore?)



Last edited by Marky Boy OZ on Wed Dec 24, 2014 3:00 am; edited 1 time in total


__________________________________________________
Mark Surman
Keep the shinny side up !

Headlight upgrade experiences Au-log12
http://www.marksurman.com
    

43Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Dec 24, 2014 2:28 am

Two Wheels Better

Two Wheels Better
Moderator
Moderator
Marky Boy OZ wrote:If my connector block servicing technique is floored please let me know.

Merry Christmas ! (Are we aloud to say that anymore?)
It's nice to see these ancient posts reappear.

Flawed and allowed they are still as far as I can tell. Yell it out at the top of your lungs.

Merry Krimbo!


__________________________________________________

1977 R75/7-R100 grey, '87 K100RS red, '93 K11-K12 aka 'Big Block' black, '96 K1100RS black, '98 K1200RS red, '09 K1300GT red, & 2013 R1200RT-Polizia black & white.

    

44Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Dec 24, 2014 6:42 am

boxermetal

boxermetal
active member
active member
Take the light apart and clean the reflector(never touch with a cloth) and the inside of the lens as well all connections. The problem with the higher output bulbs is when you go from Hi to Low beam the difference in light makes it hard to see.

http://www.boxermetal.com
    

45Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Dec 24, 2014 10:26 am

RicK G

RicK G
VIP
VIP
I did read somewhere where a guy did some fine work to the switch to enable a smoother experience but can not find it again....

I have posted here a few times about making the Hi/Lo switch a bit easier to work.  If you use a small 1/8" round file and remove a tiny bit of the step the round end of the detent runs against, make a slight groove and I mean slight or you end up with 2 positions for flash and none for Hi Beam. You probably only need to remove 0.010" from the plastic to make it work.
Usually it is only on older switches that you need to do this, when new they work fairly well but with repeated use and night time riding it isn't long before the rot sets in.


__________________________________________________
"Man sacrifices his health in order to make money.
Then he sacrifices money to recuperate his health.
And then he is so anxious about the future that he does not enjoy the present; the result being that he does not live in the present or the future; he lives as if he is never going to die, and then dies having never really lived."   Dalai Lama


Bikes 1993 K1100 LT, 1998 K1100 LT, 1993 K75 RT, 1996 K75RT, 1986 K75 GS, 1979 Z1300 Kawasaki X 2 for now
    

46Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Wed Dec 24, 2014 3:34 pm

Mark K Boy

Mark K Boy
Gold member
Gold member
@RicK G wrote:I did read somewhere where a guy did some fine work to the switch to enable a smoother experience but can not find it again....

I have posted here a few times about making the Hi/Lo switch a bit easier to work.  If you use a small 1/8" round file and remove a tiny bit of the step the round end of the detent runs against, make a slight groove and I mean slight or you end up with 2 positions for flash and none for Hi Beam. You probably only need to remove 0.010" from the plastic to make it work.
Usually it is only on older switches that you need to do this, when new they work fairly well but with repeated use and night time riding it isn't long before the rot sets in.
Thanks Rick.


__________________________________________________
Mark Surman
Keep the shinny side up !

Headlight upgrade experiences Au-log12
http://www.marksurman.com
    

47Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Headlight upgrade experiences on Tue Feb 03, 2015 10:36 am

td5

td5
Gold member
Gold member
I would recommend the kit from Jim at Eastern Beaver, very well put together and well worth the money.

    

48Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Tue Feb 03, 2015 11:44 am

krambo

krambo
Life time member
Life time member
@td5 wrote:I would recommend the kit from Jim at Eastern Beaver, very well put together and well worth the money.
Amen to that !


__________________________________________________
1984 BMW K100RT, 1993 BMW K1100LTIC,1982 Kawasaki KZ1100 Spectre
"Aut viam inveniam aut faciam." Headlight upgrade experiences Uk-bmw12
http://www.its-personal.net
    

49Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Re: Headlight upgrade experiences on Tue Feb 03, 2015 2:58 pm

Point-Seven-five

Point-Seven-five
Life time member
Life time member
+2 on Eastern Beaver.  Put his relays on both of my K's.  His workmanship is beautiful and the price is very good.  You can't buy the parts he uses for what he charges for his harnesses.


__________________________________________________
Present:
1994 K75RT
1991 K100RS
1988 K100RS SE

Past:
1994 BMW K75S
1992 BMW K100RS
1982 Honda FT500
1979 Honda XR185
1977 Honda XL125
1974 Honda XL125
1972 OSSA Pioneer 250
1968 Kawasaki 175
    

50Back to top Go down   Headlight upgrade experiences Empty Headlight upgrade on Sun May 03, 2015 1:19 am

td5

td5
Gold member
Gold member
HI Folks,
Just wondering what headlight upgrades you guys have experience here in OZ, I have heard Osram Nightbreakers are good, but does anyone have any recommendations.
I run the EB relay kit, so just looking to boost the low beam and I don't want to go the Aux lights or HID for my bike.
Cheers
Mike

    

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