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1Back to top Go down    Can the air filter be cleaned. on Tue Sep 09, 2014 10:34 pm

Holister

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At the risk of sounding like a scrooge, can the air filter be cleaned as a temp measure?
I've had the old girl for just on 6 months and for a number of reasons have not got around to changing the air filter. Prev owner said he'd done that recently at the time I bought it. 
As I've had all the fairings off over the past few days I've had the opportunity to take a look at it and found it to be very dirty. This might explain the poor fuel economy I've been getting (7.1 lit/100k). I've done just on 8k in that time. Now I'm off on the weekend on a trip for 2 weeks and not comfortable with this going back in in this condition.
Will be able to pick one up in Sydney next week anyway and I'll have more time to attend to it down there.
It's either clean it or put it back in for the 800k trip to Sydney. 
Any thought on this?

Cheers


__________________________________________________
1988 K100RT     VIN No.  0094680
1989 K100RT     VIN No.  0097367 (naked)  
1996 K1100RS   VIN No.  0451808
     Fuel:  95 Octane
Engine Oil: Nulon Full Synthetic 15W50
Gear Box Oil:  Nulon Synthetic 75W90
    

2Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Tue Sep 09, 2014 11:03 pm

beanoldboy

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sure can ,  big bits like insects and sticks will obsruct air flow and can be tapped or soft brushed out ,  smaller bits of dirt can be blown out with air -blow from clean side to air on side,  taking care not to blow a hole .  That said , eventually it is the smallest particles that will cause the complete obstruction and wont budge due to their size and electrostatic attraction . 
if after a brush/tap out your filter is still dirt coloured or oily its time to renew.

http://www.airware.com.au
    

3Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Tue Sep 09, 2014 11:24 pm

Holister

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Thanks old bean.
It's past a bit of a tap and a brush unfortunately. Seems to be clogged with a LOT of greezy shite on the intake side (not the engine side). Its really a wonder any air is getting thru at all.
Just been experimenting with degreaser and electrical cleaner (isopropyl alcohol) in that order. The small patch i've tried looks good. Will continue with that.
Better this than put that crud back in. Should've ordered a new filter back when...
Oh well. A lot on my plate lately. I'll eventually get into the swing of things.

Cheers


__________________________________________________
1988 K100RT     VIN No.  0094680
1989 K100RT     VIN No.  0097367 (naked)  
1996 K1100RS   VIN No.  0451808
     Fuel:  95 Octane
Engine Oil: Nulon Full Synthetic 15W50
Gear Box Oil:  Nulon Synthetic 75W90
    

4Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Tue Sep 09, 2014 11:29 pm

RicK G

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As beano said come compressed air and if it needs more attention http://www.brisbaneaircleaners.com.au/ I used them for many years and they had a good turn around and were heaps cheaper than a new filter. From memory it was $8 to do a filter for a 6D14 Mitsubishi Diesel and new the filter was $220


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If everything seems under control then you aint goin fast enough:- Mario Andretti
Bikes 1986 K100RT, 1993 K1100 LT, 1994 K1100 LT, 1993 K75 RT, 1996 K75RT, 1986 K75 GS, 1979 Z1300 Kawasaki X 2 & 1976 SR 500 Yamaha for now
    

5Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Wed Sep 10, 2014 12:03 am

beanoldboy

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i would suggest not putting a solvent on it,  this might cause your filter media to decompose,   even if not instantly. it is just paper

http://www.airware.com.au
    

6Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Wed Sep 10, 2014 2:34 am

Mossy1200

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I have a good condition K&N if you want a cheap purchase price. Post to aus isn't that much from nz.

    

7Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Wed Sep 10, 2014 2:38 am

Mossy1200

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Mossy1200 wrote:I have a good condition K&N if you want a cheap purchase price. Post to aus isn't that much from nz.
NZ Post economy freight shows 3 to 10 days as $25 for freight plus $30 for filter.

    

8Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Wed Sep 10, 2014 5:58 am

duck

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The notion of a K air filter restricting air flow is humorous. The air filter on Ks is HUGE for a liter(or 750cc) engine. Unless you live in an extremely dusty area they only need to be changed every 40 or 50 thousand miles.

K&N air filters are OK for some vehicles but on a K they let more crud through with no performance improvement since the air filter is so large. They also probably need to be re-oiled more frequently than K&N recommends given that the heat on Ks probably dries out the filter oil more quickly than on most other vehicles.


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Current stable:
86 Custom K100 (standard fairing, K75 Belly pan, Ceramic chromed engine covers, paralever)
K75 Frankenbrick (Paralever, K11 front end, hybrid ABS, K1100RS fairing, radial tires)
86 K75C Turbo w/ paralever
94 K1100RS
93 K1100LT (x2)
91 K1
93 K75S (K11 front end)
91 K75S
14 Yamaha WR250R
http://www.ClassicKBikes.com
    

9Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Wed Sep 10, 2014 7:00 am

RicK G

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On a system like the L Jetronic you can't get bad fuel consumption due to a bad air filter because the MAF sensor measures the air after the filter and the L Jet injects the right amount of fuel according to volume and temperature.
This dirty filter story is a hang over from carbies.


__________________________________________________
If everything seems under control then you aint goin fast enough:- Mario Andretti
Bikes 1986 K100RT, 1993 K1100 LT, 1994 K1100 LT, 1993 K75 RT, 1996 K75RT, 1986 K75 GS, 1979 Z1300 Kawasaki X 2 & 1976 SR 500 Yamaha for now
    

10Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Wed Sep 10, 2014 8:25 am

Holister

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Thanks for the input fellas. Smile  And thanks Mossy for the offer. Very kind of you. Its not that I couldn't buy one just that I didn't have time to get that in before I leave and will be away for about 2 weeks.
I'll pick one up from Hansa when I'm in Sydney next week.

Too late Beano. Tested a small patch with cheapo Export degreaser and then some spray electrical cleaner to wash that out but in the end I washed the degreaser out with a soft spray of water. Took a little drying but it washed up a treat and other than an overall light soiled appearance it looks almost new. There was no degradation of the filter material even when I tried scrubbing it with my finger.

I'll try to check its condition before I leave on Sunday but I think it will be ok.

I wish I had taken a photo of it. I really don't know how any air got thru. It was a thick black slightly oily deposit over 70% of the filter with heaps of dirt and insects embedded. The PO (who is known to me) owned the bike from 115k to 125k when I bought it in Apr (it now has 133k). He told me he'd changed all the filters so I wasn't too rushed about replacing it. It was only that I had all the fairings off to do some f/glass repairs and welding to the front tree bracket that I thought I'd take the opportunity to check it out. affraid

duck wrote:... They also probably need to be re-oiled more frequently than K&N recommends given that the heat on Ks probably dries out the filter oil more quickly than on most other vehicles.
Aren't these a dry filter? or do they need to be oiled??? If so, I'll def need to pull it back out.
I thought only foam filters were oiled.

RicK G wrote:On a system like the L Jetronic you can't get bad fuel consumption due to a bad air filter because the MAF sensor measures the air after the filter and the L Jet injects the right amount of fuel according to volume and temperature.
This dirty filter story is a hang over from carbies.

Ok. Thanks Rick.... makes sense.
Live and learn... Live and learn.
I must be just a little too heavy handed on her throttle. She seems to like it tho Wink

I'll let you know how the filter survives (or not) the 800klms to Sydney.

Cheers


__________________________________________________
1988 K100RT     VIN No.  0094680
1989 K100RT     VIN No.  0097367 (naked)  
1996 K1100RS   VIN No.  0451808
     Fuel:  95 Octane
Engine Oil: Nulon Full Synthetic 15W50
Gear Box Oil:  Nulon Synthetic 75W90
    

11Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Wed Sep 10, 2014 9:24 am

mike d


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Aren't these a dry filter? or do they need to be oiled??? If so, I'll def need to pull it back out.
I thought only foam filters were oiled.

Duck was referring to the use of K&N filters, and that due to the K's ability to generate heat would mean that they would need oiling more often than K&N currently suggest.

Mike

    

12Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Wed Sep 10, 2014 10:49 am

Corkboy

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Also I remember reading where one member (Lentini), ran a K100 on a dyno, then wrapped half the filter in cling-film (saranwrap) and recorded no drop in power.  He said the same, that the air filter is hugh and no benefit is gained from a K&N filter.

The results of the dyno were that the cheapest power upgrade was to advance the timing to 30degrees btdc @ 6000 rpm.

It's all in there
http://www.ibmwr.org/ktech.shtml

http://www.ibmwr.org/ktech/dyno/index.shtml


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Regards,

Corkboy '87 K100RS 0140995 (Gone)
             '97 K1100LT 0188024
             '08 Transalp 700
    

13Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Wed Sep 10, 2014 11:10 am

Two Wheels Better

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Agree on the size of air filters for 1+/- litre engines. If the size of current BMW air filters is any indication, albeit, now with much larger airboxes, then you're on to something. The new WasserBoxer GS & RT, the raging S1000RR, the F650/700/800-twin series, and even the K16-six, use approximately 175mm x 130mm (7" x 5") air filters. The only one to get more filter area is the Mightiest of sporting Ks, the K1200S & K1300S, which get two of those sized filters but shaped in a cone.


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'77 R75/7-1000cc, '87 K100RS, '93 K12 Big Block, '94 R100 Mystic, '03 K1200GT, '04 R1150RT, '06 K1200R, '07 K1200R & '09 K1300GT
    

14Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Wed Sep 10, 2014 11:46 pm

rosskko

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Hey Kap
depending on when you get in to Sydney, if you are stuck getting the filter I can pick one up.
Live about 15 minutes from Hansa.

I have been looking locally for a filter but cannot see one for sale.
Hansa will only take gold or diamonds as payment.

I will keep my eyes peeled.
Unfortunately I put the last new one I had into my 2nd K.

rosskk(k)o


Munich have them for $46 + postage and they are usually very good at getting something to me in a few days.
Munich
I Can't find the link on Motohansa


__________________________________________________
1986 K100RT VIN 0093801K100RT with summer fairing for a northern visitor

Basic/2 6308802K100CJ  05/1988

K1100RS 0194321
    

15Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Thu Sep 11, 2014 1:15 am

Holister

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Thanks rosskko
I'll see how it pans out. I'm on the road for 2 weeks and will be based in Newcastle with friends over that time but will get down to Sydney to visit family at some stage. I may take a trip out to Mudgee if time permits. Will be largely playing it by ear as I go. No real commitments except to stay ahead of the rain. I'll be posting as I go from my trusty tablet so will pm if a catch up is on the cards.
If you find a cheap filter pm me.

I've had good service from Show and Go Motorcycles in SA www.showandgo.com.au  Ph. (08) 8376 0333. Pricing and service were pretty competitive. bought all my rear brake parts (Metal Gear) from them. Cheapest price I could find.


Last order of parts I got from Motohansa. Pricing for consumables were pretty much the same but freight was just a flat $10.  Dispatched same day as payment. www.motohansa.com.au  Their price on an air filter is $55.


I looked at Munich but they are on the other side of the continent and their prices seemed exy at the time. I'll take another look.


I went into my local BMW dealer in Ballina and they quoted me $56 for an oil filter and $140 for a clutch cable... he said it was the last one left in Australia (wtf. I'm pretty sure I don't look like an idiot, but there you go). I literally just laughed and walked out



When I get to Sydney I'll be staying with my daughter at Lane Cove so Motohansa is just down the road.

Cheers


__________________________________________________
1988 K100RT     VIN No.  0094680
1989 K100RT     VIN No.  0097367 (naked)  
1996 K1100RS   VIN No.  0451808
     Fuel:  95 Octane
Engine Oil: Nulon Full Synthetic 15W50
Gear Box Oil:  Nulon Synthetic 75W90
    

16Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Thu Sep 11, 2014 11:55 am

k75RT Keith

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Air compressor and shoot from what is the underside of the filter.  Temporary fix at best, but should get you maybe an additional 1000k.  While you ave the filter out, feel around in the air box for foreign material and debris.

    

17Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Thu Sep 11, 2014 10:55 pm

Holister

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k75RT Keith wrote:Air compressor and shoot from what is the underside of the filter.  Temporary fix at best, but should get you maybe an additional 1000k.  While you ave the filter out, feel around in the air box for foreign material and debris.

Thanks Keith. A few posts have suggested using compressed air but I would suggest that this will infact damage the filter material allowing even larger particles to enter the engine causing greater damage. Compressed air from a small nozzle is abrasive and will also will have the effect of 'opening up' the fibres of the filter material.

In particular, "shooting from.... the underside" would force dust particles thru the filter causing even more damage. [TOP ] is clearly marked on the side of the filter and air intake is from the underside (bottom). This is where the dirt deposits are found so therefore it would make sense to "shoot" from the top when applying any cleaning.

A tap and maybe a brush is all that should be required but my filter (as I've said previously) was way beyond that with a thick pastey oily deposit that had saturated pretty much thru to the top of the filter

Cheers


__________________________________________________
1988 K100RT     VIN No.  0094680
1989 K100RT     VIN No.  0097367 (naked)  
1996 K1100RS   VIN No.  0451808
     Fuel:  95 Octane
Engine Oil: Nulon Full Synthetic 15W50
Gear Box Oil:  Nulon Synthetic 75W90
    

18Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Thu Sep 11, 2014 11:05 pm

charlie99

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I went into my local BMW dealer in Ballina and they quoted me $56 for an oil filter and $140 for a clutch cable... he said it was the last one left in Australia (wtf. I'm pretty sure I don't look like an idiot, but there you go). I literally just laughed and walked out



motobins or motoworks have sheds full of them   and a choice of original or after market

and only a few days delivery if you time it right

prices aren't bad either

have had good service out of hf 163 oil filters ...stocked by most good motor cycle dealers ...and under 15 bucks


good luck


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cheezy grin whilst riding, kinda bloke ....oh the joy !!!! ...... ( brick aviator )

'86 K100 RT..#0090401 ..."Gerty" ( Gertrude Von Clickandshift ) --------O%O
    

19Back to top Go down    Re: Can the air filter be cleaned. on Fri Sep 12, 2014 2:28 am

Holister

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charlie99 wrote:motobins or motoworks have sheds full of them   and a choice of original or after market

and only a few days delivery if you time it right

prices aren't bad either

have had good service out of hf 163 oil filters ...stocked by most good motor cycle dealers ...and under 15 bucks


good luck
Freight seems fairly pricey. What do you use? Their mail would be worth it but there's no insurance and how long does that take to get out here? Also doubling up on items from Motobins doesn't apear to save anything on freight.

Pattern/generic air filter by mail
1x - A$33
2x - A$61

Also. How good are their pattern/generic filters?


__________________________________________________
1988 K100RT     VIN No.  0094680
1989 K100RT     VIN No.  0097367 (naked)  
1996 K1100RS   VIN No.  0451808
     Fuel:  95 Octane
Engine Oil: Nulon Full Synthetic 15W50
Gear Box Oil:  Nulon Synthetic 75W90
    

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