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1Back to top Go down    Engine cleaning on Mon Apr 13, 2015 4:49 am

aladin1

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I'm now well into dismantling my 1985 K100RT for a refurb and ready to start cleaning up the engine casing of oxides and road crud. Question: do I restore the engine to its former polished glory or do I have the engine covers powder coated to save on future elbow grease. 
Any comments?

    

2Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Mon Apr 13, 2015 12:09 pm

gabriel


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Hi Aladin1

This is my opinion and I am in no way suggesting this is the only approach to cleaning the engine.
Many riders take the approach of sodablasting and painting the engine cases.
I have noticed those who adopt this approach often find the cases oxidize within months of been cleaned. Sodablasting/sandblasting seems to damage the cases and then you are left with a situation where the cases have to be painted. 
Painting the cases might seem like a permanent solution but it's very easy for the surfaces to be damaged by stones and road debris which then allows moisture to penetrate the paint layers and create bubbles beneath the paint surface.

Bmw never painted the engine and gearbox. But it seems a protective coating might have been applied which might explain why the cases don't oxidise. Sandblasting perhaps destroys the original finish and they begin to oxidise which gives a horrible appearance.
Halo and other riders have mentioned this situation.
My approach was to use an abrasive nylon brush attached to a drill and use a lubricant such as WD40. My cases look great and after twelve months there is no sign of oxidisation. 
Steel brushes are a big no no. They damage and remove the original surface finish and starts the oxiddisation process.
It's also a much cheaper option.
That's my opinion.
Feedback is appreciated.

Good luck with your Reno.

Cheers
Gabriel

    

3Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:13 pm

aladin1

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Hi Gabriel

Thanks for your valued comments which Have definitely swayed me towards polishing the engine. I was going to try nylon abrasive pads with an aluminium cleaner but I'll try the WD40 method first.
If my engine stays as oxide free as you suggest it might I'll be very happy as I am an unashamed fair weather biker who rides purely for fun and avoids our UK winter salted roads like the plague. 

Regards, Aladin1.   

    

4Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:43 pm

Dai

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Vapour blasting will work well. It's a two-stage process; first the crud is cleaned off the surface using a very fine slurry and then the surface is effectively re-sealed when it's actually vapour blasted. I have a Moto Guzzi LeMans IV engine that was vapour blasted over four years ago and it still looks brand new.


__________________________________________________
'83 K100 upgraded to K100RS spec
Others...
'78 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, '79 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,'93 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California,
'03 Suzuki Blandit GSF600SK3 (NFS any more because wifey has claimed it)
    

5Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Mon Apr 13, 2015 5:04 pm

aladin1

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Hi Dai

I've just had a look at vapour blasting on YouTube and it looks very effective. I don't want to strip the engine any more than I have to as it is mechanically sound but the engine covers could be blasted if the surfaces are resealed during the process. Was your Guzzi engine a Matt finish after blasting or does the process leave the surface clean but smooth?

Regards Aladin1

    

6Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Mon Apr 13, 2015 7:05 pm

Crazy Frog

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gabriel wrote:Steel brushes are a big no no. They damage and remove the original surface finish and starts the oxiddisation process.
It's also a much cheaper option.
That's my opinion.
Feedback is appreciated.

Good luck with your Reno.

Cheers
Gabriel
First, I don't think the aluminum engine parts have a surface finish on it. Just look at old rice cookers and you will see that with age the varnish starts to peel and become yellow.
Even if the BMW had a coating, the oxidation would be the result of the protection being destroyed. Using a steel brush would remove it totally to have a uniform surface.
The only bad think about using a steel brush is that it could leave particles of metal which would be embedded in the aluminum resulting of tiny little spots of rust. (I never had that happening to me)
What ever you do (at the exception of painting) will always be a temporary solution and corrosion will always re-appears.
I polished my engines with a steel brush and finished it with a nylon pad.
Every year, I just have to spend a couple of hours to refinish the engine with a nylon pad.
To clean the engine(and the painted surfaces too), I import a product from France called abnet
It is incredible but not imported in North America. If you buy some, DO NOT show it to your wife. She will love it and you won't see the container again. -
Do not buy the ready mix one as it has 90% water and 10 % product. - Buy the concentrate and dilute it yourself
This product has the property of going between the support and the dirt (even greasy dirt) and lift the dirt off.
You spray it, let it work for 1 minute and then rinse it. It even work with oxidation.
Imagine, when I go on vacation to France, I prefer to bring back this product in stead of duty free French wine.....
I never found anything better, and it doesn't contain any chemical components. It's even safe to clean your dish with it. The only thing is that the smell is not the most pleasant but it dissipate within minutes.


Look how clean these engines are.... Not shiny like chrome, but just clean and free of oxidation


__________________________________________________
1986 k75, 1985 K100rt, 1985 K100rt/EML sidecar.
    

7Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Mon Apr 13, 2015 8:13 pm

indian036

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"To clean the engine(and the painted surfaces too), I import a product from France called abnet"


You could have mentioned this before I left France two weeks ago.  Wink Wink    Now I'll have to wait till September or so.


Bill


__________________________________________________
1985 K100RT Red.  VIN 0028991K100RT    ENG 104EA248523386
1985 K100RT Blue. VIN 0029036K100RT    ENG 104EA25852071
1990 K100LT Black. VIN WB105060310190452
1984 K100RT White. VIN. 0023022K100RT  ENG 104EA32848523
    

8Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Mon Apr 13, 2015 8:28 pm

92KK 84WW Olaf


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indian036 wrote:"To clean the engine(and the painted surfaces too), I import a product from France called abnet"


You could have mentioned this before I left France two weeks ago.  Wink Wink    Now I'll have to wait till September or so.


Bill

Or you could bribe TacKler to bring some back in June......


__________________________________________________
1992 K100LT 0193214 101,000 miles
1984 K100RT 0022575 Baja Red bought 36,000 now 84,100 miles
    

9Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Wed Apr 15, 2015 2:58 am

gabriel


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Hi everyone

I a happy to post photos if somebody can explain how I can post photos using an iPad.

Cheers

    

10Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Wed Apr 15, 2015 3:08 am

gabriel


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I agree with Crazy Frog. 
I used an abrasive nylon brush attached to a hand drill at a high speed setting and a lubricant WD40. A nylon wheel was difficult to use on the engine and gearbox, final drive and swing arm.
This method will give you a nice çlean finish. 
Be careful you don't use excessive force or you might develop swirl marks on the cases. 
You are more likely to scratch the surface using steel brushes.
I don't think polishing the cases is realistic.
Vapour blasting is an option but you have to completely dismantle components. Lets not forget the cost.
Good luck.
I would live to post photos but don't know how.

    

11Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Wed Apr 15, 2015 3:35 am

JR_K100RS

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G'day All , there was a whole thread about using "sunlight" soap & steel wool , I use "velvet" soap & steel wool ( on the cases ) & they look great

John R

Melbourne Australia


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Diamond Grey ( 617 ) 1987 K100RS ( European Delivery ) Original owner
    

12Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Wed Apr 15, 2015 7:02 pm

Dai

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aladin1 wrote:Hi Dai

I've just had a look at vapour blasting on YouTube and it looks very effective. I don't want to strip the engine any more than I have to as it is mechanically sound but the engine covers could be blasted if the surfaces are resealed during the process. Was your Guzzi engine a Matt finish after blasting or does the process leave the surface clean but smooth?

Regards Aladin1
It's more of a satin finish rather than anything else.


__________________________________________________
'83 K100 upgraded to K100RS spec
Others...
'78 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, '79 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,'93 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California,
'03 Suzuki Blandit GSF600SK3 (NFS any more because wifey has claimed it)
    

13Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Wed Apr 15, 2015 7:45 pm

Comberjohn

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Gabriel, can you describe the nylon brush used in a hand drill in a bit more detail?
Is it something you would buy in a hardware shop or tool store?
By the way, I can't upload pics from my iPad either.


__________________________________________________
Life is not a rehearsal.

2010 R1200GS
1986 K100 Silver(gone)
2012 K1600GT(gone)
1984 K100RT Madison Silver(gone)
1989 K100LT Stratus Grey(gone)
1984 K100 Red(gone)
http://www.johnsdrivingschool.co
    

14Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Wed Apr 15, 2015 10:00 pm

Holister

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Comberjohn wrote:.....
By the way, I can't upload pics from my iPad either.
Nor from an Android device


__________________________________________________
1988 K100RT     VIN No.  0094680
1989 K100RT     VIN No.  0097367 (naked)  
1996 K1100RS   VIN No.  0451808
     Fuel:  95 Octane
Engine Oil: Nulon Full Synthetic 15W50
Gear Box Oil:  Nulon Synthetic 75W90
    

15Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Wed Apr 15, 2015 11:08 pm

gabriel


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Hardware stores usually stock these brushes.
Try and find an abrasive brush which will do the least damage to your cases..I prefer nylon brushes which are easier to handle and manoeuvre around the cases.
Josco is an Australian company which manufactures nylon brushes.
You will most likely have an equivalent product in your country.you don't need an expensive hand drill, but it's important that you select a high speed.
Try different speeds and you will notice when the nylon brush starts to clean your cases.
My engine was not corroded. Not certain how deteriated your cases are but I suggest you have a go.

    

16Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Thu Apr 16, 2015 12:49 pm

88

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This  type of brush  Gabriel?


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88....May contain nuts!

"The world is a book and those who do not travel read only one page." - St. Augustine from 1600 years ago & still true!

Bike: K100LT 1988. 0172363. AKA the Bullion Brick!
Mods: k1100 screen and stands

K1100rs 1995, Remus exhaust.
    

17Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Thu Apr 16, 2015 1:59 pm

aladin1

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Hi Dai

Satin finish is good for me. I think I'll have my covers vapour blasted and try the WD 40/nylon brush method on the engine block. 

Regards, Aladin1

    

18Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Thu Apr 16, 2015 5:36 pm

gabriel


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The image didn't download
Go to bunnings.com.au and do a search using the keyword "nylon brush".

    

19Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Thu Apr 16, 2015 6:18 pm

Holister

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Thanks gabriel. Nice tip. Cheers

Technical info including grit and rpm from here
http://www.josco.com.au/newsite/jia/products/brushware/josco/josco_an.htm

And this is interesting...
http://www.josco.com.au/newsite/jsf/brush_products/abrasive_nylon_brushes.htm


__________________________________________________
1988 K100RT     VIN No.  0094680
1989 K100RT     VIN No.  0097367 (naked)  
1996 K1100RS   VIN No.  0451808
     Fuel:  95 Octane
Engine Oil: Nulon Full Synthetic 15W50
Gear Box Oil:  Nulon Synthetic 75W90
    

20Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Thu Apr 16, 2015 6:24 pm

rosskko

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Check out Alexander McCarthy and his water (hydro) blasting

HYDRO

And his thread on his TIC resto

Also look at almost any thread started by MIKE P


__________________________________________________
1986 K100RT VIN 0093801K100RT with summer fairing for a northern visitor

Basic/2 6308802K100CJ  05/1988

K1100RS 0194321
    

21Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Fri Apr 17, 2015 7:09 pm

gabriel


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Hydroblasting us an option, so is gold plating....the issue is how much do you want to spend?
I believe BMW didn't paint the drivetrain including the engine for a reason.
I have seen many paintjobs ending up looking tacky..that's just my opinion...I might be wrong??
Why not keep up simple..less is better?
Cheers

    

22Back to top Go down    Re: Engine cleaning on Sat Apr 18, 2015 5:29 pm

Crazy Frog

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Here is how the abnet works on cleaning.
As I am just starting to work on the bike, a big cleanup is required.
Here are the pictures of the final drive. I honestly didn't spend more than 2 minutes cleaning it.
I sprayed it, and 2 minutes after I took a nylon pad and water to rinse it. Even the oil came off when I rinsed it.

Don't ask about the oil marks on the FD.....
I had removed the speedo sensor and when I put the FD on the bench looking at the open hole, I said OH sh*&$!... I don't have anymore oil. I turned the FD upside down and realized my mistake. I was not looking at the filling hole where oil level should be at the bottom of the thread.

Before

After


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1986 k75, 1985 K100rt, 1985 K100rt/EML sidecar.
    

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