BMW K bikes (Bricks)

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WDB90

WDB90
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I love the weight reduction & space savings but I am wondering about the Motronic and ABS Controller being mounted on/by it since I am assuming the circuit board inside the Shorai (yet I couldn’t find any info about this) is making the battery work like or behave like a lead-acid battery and might spray RFI/EMI all over the place….
Am I just spewing old electronic classes’ info stuck in my brain?
 
Am I just assuming that a 1993 charging system never planned to co-exist with the charge controlling needs of a 2020 lith-ion battery. 
 
I am considering making battery box that includes a grounded metal signal barrier plate between the BMW goodies and the battery.  If I tuck them all together I will have room for the secret spot for the tool roll.

Any thoughts?
- Lilya

    

gorio

gorio
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Far from an expert opinion but I think the old lead acid battery like made a pretty good magnetic field all on it's own. For the most part modern electronics are pretty safe. It just electronics to control the charge and discharge rates.


__________________________________________________
1992 K100rs 16v
1997 R1100rt
2006 R1200rt
Past lives
Kawasaki Concours
1976 BMW R90s
1975 Ducati 860gt
1992 Honda VFR750
1985 Honda VF750
1982 Kawasaki 750GPZ
1975 Norton 850 Commando
    

Laitch

Laitch
Life time member
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@WDB90 wrote:Any thoughts?
You've made this conversion seem like a real adventure but Bob doesn't seem to care much one way or the other. Laughing


__________________________________________________
1995 K75 81,000 miles
Shorai Lithium Ion battery on a ’93 K1100rs?  Usa-lo10
    

Point-Seven-five

Point-Seven-five
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Are you doing a cafe conversion or racing this bike? As far as I know, a lithium battery only saves about 10-12 pounds over a sealed AGM battery. That isn't much on a bike with a one-up gross weight of around 700 pounds.

To answer your original question, outside of a bike that had a lithium battery fire a few years ago there hasn't been any reported problems with lithium batteries on K bikes, so if you want to use one it won't interfere with the way the bike works.


__________________________________________________
Present:
1994 K75RT
1991 K100RS
1988 K100RS SE

Past:
1994 BMW K75S
1992 BMW K100RS
1982 Honda FT500
1979 Honda XR185
1977 Honda XL125
1974 Honda XL125
1972 OSSA Pioneer 250
1968 Kawasaki 175
    

Point-Seven-five

Point-Seven-five
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@Laitch wrote:
@WDB90 wrote:Any thoughts?
You've made this conversion seem like a real adventure but Bob doesn't seem to care much one way or the other. Laughing

Except that the final line of the article sounds an awful lot like he's pitching lithium batteries. That aside, I tend to disagree that the "average battery charger puts out 8 volts". Maybe if you're charging the battery in a 1962 VW bug, but even my 45 year old 6 amp Craftsman charger puts out 13.8 volts and if you only leave it connected for 2 hours will do a nice job of safely charging an AGM battery to the point where it will start my bike so the bike's alternator can finish the job.

I have no experience with charging lithium vehicle batteries and can't comment on whether a conventional ferroresonent charger like my old Craftsman will damage one. All I know is that a smart lithium charger just makes the changeover to lithium that much more expensive.


__________________________________________________
Present:
1994 K75RT
1991 K100RS
1988 K100RS SE

Past:
1994 BMW K75S
1992 BMW K100RS
1982 Honda FT500
1979 Honda XR185
1977 Honda XL125
1974 Honda XL125
1972 OSSA Pioneer 250
1968 Kawasaki 175
    

6Back to top Go down   Shorai Lithium Ion battery on a ’93 K1100rs?  Empty The Shorai weighs in at 3 pounds. Tue Apr 06, 2021 2:05 am

WDB90

WDB90
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New member
Thank you for the link to Bob's info. 
Since I was given the battery (new), I will invest in a suitable charger.  
I am not racing nor making a café racer (yet) out of the K1100rs.  I am simply attempting to reduce the weight of what could be a serious boat anchor.
Reason being, I am 5'6" and this bike is simply heavy.  I am used to riding my BSA B33 (380 pounds) and Santa Cruz Stigmata (carbon bicycle -17 pounds).  

I must admit that I really enjoy the K bike for touring.  I am planning a 2.5 k trip mid May.  Just getting all the info I can.

Once again,
Thanks for your time & trouble!!!

LV

    

Suzi Q

Suzi Q
Life time member
Life time member
I've been using lithium iron batteries for a while now: one on the K75 Madass, and others on various Motronic boxers. No issues other than the LiFe's quirky habit of struggling to crank the bike when cold, then warming itself up for thirty seconds or so, then starting the bike okay.
I think the big safety issue with LiFe is not to exceed the safe charging voltage of 14.8V. Some modern 'smart' chargers might do this, which is the main reason why it's best to use a LiFe compatible charger. A bike's charging system won't exceed this, which is why it's okay to chuck LiFe batteries on any old crate.
I've used a 19Wh battery (JMT YTZ5S) for the last year on the 750 engine and it certainly cranks it okay. But it hasn't got much reserve after a few starts-and-then-stops-in-the-garage. I'm going to swap it for the next rating size up: 29Wh (JMT YTZ7S), which is physically the same size anyway.


__________________________________________________
Sometimes I'm not really Suzi Quatro.
    

BobT

BobT
Life time member
Life time member
Lithium batteries are great. The original battery on most Ks was a heavy old wet battery with acid that did not produce many cranking amps (CCA) but weighed a ton. Later came AGM/gel batteries, BMW fitted them to the later 1100 and 1200 Ks, the were half the size, weighed half the weight and had more cranking amps than the old ones. Lithium is just the next stage, about a quarter of the weight of the AGM/gel with even more CCA. 
There are many other benefits to Lithium, they last about twice as long as an older generation battery, they do not lose their charge over time if there is nothing draining them (alarms etc), eliminating the need for a top up charger. The bikes electrical system supplies volts to charge a battery and does not know what battery technology is getting those volts.
Many people will say that they catch fire, well so does the fuel in your tank if you abuse it. How many fires have there been from the lithium batteries used in your phone, tablet, electric toothbrush and the many other household items. BMW offer lithium as an extra for the S1000XR, Ducati fit them in some of their bikes too. All electric motorcycles have them.
Before the experts come along and say that the bike was designed for a wet lead acid battery, it never was. The bike was designed to propel you along on two wheels. BMW used the latest tech that was available at that time. You would not use 1980s oil or tyres, so why not fit a lithium battery.
My Ducati 939 Supersport is up for sale with its 6 year old lithium still fitted, I had that battery in my Ducati 848 before the Supersport and it has never let me down. The standard Yuasa AGM/gel battery weighs 3.6 kg, the lithium weighs 600 grams.
My brand new BMW R1250RS will have a lithium fitted within the next month, I was looking at it on the web yesterday evening to decide which lithium to fit.

    

Suzi Q

Suzi Q
Life time member
Life time member
...and you can't do this with a lead acid.... Very Happy

https://youtu.be/Zb69CUG80Eg


__________________________________________________
Sometimes I'm not really Suzi Quatro.
    

WDB90

WDB90
New member
New member
Oh dang, I now need two more so I can practice juggling... (o)

    

Laitch

Laitch
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Life time member
@WDB90 wrote:Oh dang, I now need two more so I can practice juggling... (o)
You'll discover, as the YouTuber did, that one's enough challenge. They're anti-gravity!  Smile


__________________________________________________
1995 K75 81,000 miles
Shorai Lithium Ion battery on a ’93 K1100rs?  Usa-lo10
    

Suzi Q

Suzi Q
Life time member
Life time member
Erm the youtuber was me - yep it jumped clean out of my hand. 
That kind of stuff happens to me a lot  scratch


__________________________________________________
Sometimes I'm not really Suzi Quatro.
    

Dai

Dai
Life time member
Life time member
@BobT wrote:How many fires have there been from the lithium batteries used in your phone, tablet, electric toothbrush and the many other household items.
Quite a few Bob. It's an ever-present problem in the aviation industry. I get the daily safety briefings and reports from the various aviation authorities and more of those than you would like deal with onboard fires started by runaway lithium batteries in passengers' phones/tablets/etc.. Also, ask Boeing about it. There were more onboard fires and near-fires caused by their use of lithium batteries in the 787 than were ever reported in the daily press. If you ever find a lithium battery with a slight bulge in it, drop it in a large bucket of water and walk away.


__________________________________________________
1983 K100 upgraded to K100RS spec, 1987 K100RT
Others...
1978 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, 1979 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,1993 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California
2020 Royal Enfield Bullet 500
    

BobT

BobT
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@Dai wrote:
@BobT wrote:How many fires have there been from the lithium batteries used in your phone, tablet, electric toothbrush and the many other household items.
Quite a few Bob. It's an ever-present problem in the aviation industry. I get the daily safety briefings and reports from the various aviation authorities and more of those than you would like deal with onboard fires started by runaway lithium batteries in passengers' phones/tablets/etc.. Also, ask Boeing about it. There were more onboard fires and near-fires caused by their use of lithium batteries in the 787 than were ever reported in the daily press. If you ever find a lithium battery with a slight bulge in it, drop it in a large bucket of water and walk away.
No not quite a few. Everybody carries at least one with them in their mobile phone, that is about 70,000,000 in just the UK. I doubt if there is more than two or three problems a month, that is not a lot.
Not many people take their motorcycles on a 787. Those fitted to aircraft are nothing like motorcycle batteries, they don't even use the same voltage. I had a lithium on the last aircraft that I owned with no problems. 
They sell thousands of lithium motorcycle batteries every year and manufacturers fit them as standard to some bikes so if you believe the internet myths then don't use one on your bike. How do you manage to ride the bike with 20 litres of highly explosive petrol above the hot engine?

    

Laitch

Laitch
Life time member
Life time member
@BobT wrote:
@Dai wrote:
@BobT wrote:How many fires have there been from the lithium batteries used in your phone, tablet, electric toothbrush and the many other household items.
Quite a few Bob. It's an ever-present problem in the aviation industry. 
They sell thousands of lithium motorcycle batteries every year and manufacturers fit them as standard to some bikes . . . 
Although the label Lithium-Ion covers differing chemical compositions of Lithium batteries, two types of Lithium batteries seem to be under discussion here but Shorai doesn't offer Lithium Ion batteries on their website at all. Shorai offers Lithium Iron batteries. 

From what I've read, Lithium-Iron and what are frequently labeled Lithium-Ion batteries have differing chemical compositions and uses but they both pack energy in smaller packages than equivalent conventional batteries. The so-called Lithium-Ion battery tends to be used in phones, computers and electronic equipment. The Lithium Iron battery is larger, more thermally stable and more heat-resistant than the Lithium-Ion battery; hence, one of its uses is in powering motorcycles.


__________________________________________________
1995 K75 81,000 miles
Shorai Lithium Ion battery on a ’93 K1100rs?  Usa-lo10
    

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