BMW K bikes (Bricks)

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1Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Battery Business on Fri Jun 13, 2014 4:16 am

Be made

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Ok

Having dealt off the same guys for over 30 years now I have no reason not to trust what these people say, about all aspects pertaining to motorcycling and mechanicals in general. HOWEVER . . .

When I was in the final throws of the rebuild on the K I purchased  new battery, yuasa 05030 model , it think it was. Anyway, I got this battery shipped to my city and uplifted it in DRY condition, =  NO ACID ADDED. I was to go and buy some acid and fill it myself. The bike shop paid the freight and got it shipped without the need for an hazardous goods courier service which was fine. I paid $116.00 which I thought was bloody good. The battery is exactly the right specs and size and is "the one" for the K bikes

Here is the things I need to know and if members can enlighten me on these things I will be eternally grateful


  1. Given the fact that parts (correct one) are getting more and more difficult to obtain I asked my guy if I purchased 2 or 3 of these batteries in dry condition would the condition of the batteries deterioate over time. He said "yes they will and I don't advise you buying them in advance" I was under the impression that dry batteries only deterioate AFTER acid is added
  2. When topping up the batteries what if I use acid instead of water -wil this lengthen the life of the battery (I thought it would) He said "no -that's not a good idea, just use distilled water"
  3. Should I leave the battery on a trickle charger when The bike is not used - again, I thought the answer was yes and he said "no"

Now, don't get me wrong, I trust this guy, as I said and have done so for 30 odd years but I have to ask myself has he got all his battery information completely wrong or hae I , maybe he is expecting me to take the advice knowing that I will buy more batteries off him sooner than needed but that seems unlikely as sales strategy knowing that if I get confirmation he is all wrong I would not hesitate to go elsewhere forever and a day and he would lose all future sales from me

so . .  any ideas please members ???

    

2Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Fri Jun 13, 2014 4:24 am

RicK G

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He is right in everything he said.


__________________________________________________
"Man sacrifices his health in order to make money.
Then he sacrifices money to recuperate his health.
And then he is so anxious about the future that he does not enjoy the present; the result being that he does not live in the present or the future; he lives as if he is never going to die, and then dies having never really lived."   Dalai Lama


Bikes 1993 K1100 LT, 1998 K1100 LT, 1993 K75 RT, 1996 K75RT, 1986 K75 GS, 1979 Z1300 Kawasaki X 2 for now
    

3Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Fri Jun 13, 2014 5:12 am

Guest

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These days I would never use a wet acid battery. All modern bikes get various sorts of gel battery which will not spill and throw acid everywhere should you drop your bike.
Batteries will never get scarce, there are thousands on ebay.de from many manufacturers that fit the K. I use a Hawker Oddysey PC680 on my bike, made in the US and fitted to many bikes and ultralites. It is about half the size of the 30 year old design wet acid battery with more punch.

    

4Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Fri Jun 13, 2014 5:22 am

AL-58

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Long term use of a low amp trickle charger will sulphate and eventually kill a battery.  A multi-stage charger is a different thing again.

I find that most modern bikes have AGM batteries which are not the same as a gel battery. The AGM is also no spill, sealed has higher starting current than Gel and also the AGM can be charged at the same voltage as standard wet-cell. Gel should be charged at a lower volt setting, if charged at too high a rate you can bake the gel which reduces its capacity.  Gel is good, I just think that AGM is a better technology for a starting battery.

Al


__________________________________________________
'87 K100RS/HRD sidecar (1100 motor)  sc25 
'92 K100RS-16v (Paint it Black)

'87 K100RT with Paralever backend

"When I'm too old and too foolish to handle a sidecar I'll buy a Sportsbike"

Battery Business K-dogs10
    

5Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Fri Jun 13, 2014 5:34 am

Guest

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I use the term gel as a generic term. BMW have been using gel batteries for years now. My Oddysey is, of course, an AGM battery.

    

6Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Fri Jun 13, 2014 6:05 pm

Be made

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bikerboy wrote:These days I would never use a wet acid battery. All modern bikes get various sorts of gel battery which will not spill and throw acid everywhere should you drop your bike.
Batteries will never get scarce, there are thousands on ebay.de from many manufacturers that fit the K. I use a Hawker Oddysey PC680 on my bike, made in the US and fitted to many bikes and ultralites. It is about half the size of the 30 year old design wet acid battery with more punch.
Excellent/ Thank you. So then, one more question . . roughly how long do batteries last. one year, 2, years or maybe more?

    

7Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Fri Jun 13, 2014 7:29 pm

Guest

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Standard Gel batteries lasted: 8 years in my wifes R1100S, 7 years in my R1100S, and as for the other BMWs, I never keep them long enough to know. The PC680 has been in my ultralight for around 6 years and will turn the 4 cylinder 1400cc 100 hp engine over even if it has been left for 4 months.

    

8Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Fri Jun 13, 2014 10:29 pm

JR_K100RS

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G'day Be made , I'm also using a PC680 AGM , it's 5-6 years old , no problems , no messy acid spills /corrosive fumes , IMHO it's the way to go

JR


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Diamond Grey ( 617 ) 1987 K100RS ( European Delivery ) Original owner
    

9Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Fri Jun 13, 2014 11:03 pm

Be made

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@JR_K100RS wrote:G'day Be made , I'm also using a PC680 AGM , it's 5-6 years old , no problems , no messy acid spills /corrosive fumes , IMHO it's the way to go

JR
Thank you . . and
bikerboy wrote:Standard Gel batteries lasted: 8 years in my wifes R1100S, 7 years in my R1100S, and as for the other BMWs, I never keep them long enough to know. The PC680 has been in my ultralight for around 6 years and will turn the 4 cylinder 1400cc 100 hp engine over even if it has been left for 4 months.
Thank you! Now I know whats the go

Mind you . .  @ $440! . . wow . .

http://www.mrpositive.co.nz/search.php?search_query=PC680

4x the price . .mmm . . .would like to see how long the standard acid one last for

Regards

Keith

    

10Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Fri Jun 13, 2014 11:09 pm

RicK G

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I use a Motobatt battery and it is now 8 years old and still going well. I couldn't recommend them highly enough.


__________________________________________________
"Man sacrifices his health in order to make money.
Then he sacrifices money to recuperate his health.
And then he is so anxious about the future that he does not enjoy the present; the result being that he does not live in the present or the future; he lives as if he is never going to die, and then dies having never really lived."   Dalai Lama


Bikes 1993 K1100 LT, 1998 K1100 LT, 1993 K75 RT, 1996 K75RT, 1986 K75 GS, 1979 Z1300 Kawasaki X 2 for now
    

11Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Sat Jun 14, 2014 12:08 am

AL-58

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I've got 7 years on a Panasonic LC-P1228P UPS battery (AGM technology, which also means no acid spills or fumes etc) now, still running just fine.  The bike does get left for months without riding sometimes, doesn't always get put on a charger but it just keeps going.  Nothing against the Odyssey, but at $175 for the Panasonic vs $350-375 for the equivalent Odyssey from the same supplier it's a real easy choice.

So I bought the same Panasonic for the 16v. 

Al


__________________________________________________
'87 K100RS/HRD sidecar (1100 motor)  sc25 
'92 K100RS-16v (Paint it Black)

'87 K100RT with Paralever backend

"When I'm too old and too foolish to handle a sidecar I'll buy a Sportsbike"

Battery Business K-dogs10
    

12Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Mon Jun 16, 2014 2:15 am

Be made

Be made
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@AL-58 wrote:I've got 7 years on a Panasonic LC-P1228P UPS battery (AGM technology, which also means no acid spills or fumes etc) now, still running just fine.  The bike does get left for months without riding sometimes, doesn't always get put on a charger but it just keeps going.  Nothing against the Odyssey, but at $175 for the Panasonic vs $350-375 for the equivalent Odyssey from the same supplier it's a real easy choice.

So I bought the same Panasonic for the 16v. 

Al
Thankyou. This is more like what I was hoping for.Nothing like this forum in the whole world, thanks guys  Battery Business 502531

    

13Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Mon Jun 16, 2014 5:20 am

TacKler

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And just to spoil the party I had my original 1991 BMW battery fitted to the bike for 13 years before it finally died.  I had to the check the manufactured date on the battery because I did not believe it. 

It did discharge a few times and I always use distilled water to top it up.  Nothing since has come near to that.


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Red 1991 K75S
    

14Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Mon Jun 16, 2014 7:30 am

the.postman

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I have a  generic  32Ah lawnmower battery @ £37 cheap as chips and guaranteed for 2yrs. the last one lasted just over 3 before it started to fail.

Never having riden the bike in Aus, I've had no problems with acid spills  lol!


__________________________________________________
1985 K100 RS   104EA49840092        #0081788     SILVERish (Madison) Prod. date 05/12/84
1984 srx 600
1986 cbr1000f/h
    

15Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Wed Jun 18, 2014 2:15 am

Be made

Be made
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@TacKler wrote:And just to spoil the party I had my original 1991 BMW battery fitted to the bike for 13 years before it finally died.  I had to the check the manufactured date on the battery because I did not believe it. 

It did discharge a few times and I always use distilled water to top it up.  Nothing since has come near to that.
Hell yeah . . . thats very cool.

Unfortunately I will have to wait until mine dies to see just how long it goes for but I am hoping (if its anything like the cars) to get about 5 years or more out of it.

@ $120ish thats like, . . . $20 a year.

Just out of interest . .  what was the replacement battery? Type / model / cost ??

    

16Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Thu Jun 19, 2014 2:04 am

JR_K100RS

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Thanks the.postman , that actually explains a lot , I never had battery issues when I rode the thing in Europe only when I got it home

Ta for that

JR


__________________________________________________
Diamond Grey ( 617 ) 1987 K100RS ( European Delivery ) Original owner
    

17Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Thu Jun 19, 2014 7:42 pm

TacKler

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@Be made wrote:
@TacKler wrote:And just to spoil the party I had my original 1991 BMW battery fitted to the bike for 13 years before it finally died.  I had to the check the manufactured date on the battery because I did not believe it. 

It did discharge a few times and I always use distilled water to top it up.  Nothing since has come near to that.
Hell yeah . . . thats very cool.

Unfortunately I will have to wait until mine dies to see just how long it goes for but I am hoping (if its anything like the cars) to get about 5 years or more out of it.

@ $120ish thats like, . . . $20 a year.

Just out of interest . .  what was the replacement battery? Type / model / cost ??
I replaced it with another BMW battery from the dealer, expecting the same result.  But alas, I was disappointed.  It probably lasted 3 or 4 years which is what I normally expect with a battery.  It cost about $160? 

Nowadays, Battery World normally have what I want on the shelf as I normally want a new battery straight away.  I'm still using wet batteries and because my work supplied distilled water ran out, I have to buy it. 

Most car or bike batteries I buy are around the $100 mark, and the car is still going strong after 4 years.  But with winter approaching will see how it handles the cold.

Cheers, Dave.


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Red 1991 K75S
    

18Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Fri Jun 20, 2014 12:16 am

K75cster

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The old Mareg BMW batt lasted 7 years, the Mareg before it lasted 10, The 7 year batt was because I left the bike with my little brother whilst I travelled by Caravan around OZ and when I got back to my bike it was as flat as, so only 7 years. I now have a Motobatt bought last year


__________________________________________________
Keith - 1987 K75c with r100rt replica fairing and half of a 1984 K100rt 1992 K1100LT a blue one

The Clever are adept at extricating themselves from situations that the wise would have avoided from the outset - QUOTE from david Hillel in Out of the Earth.
    

19Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Fri Jun 20, 2014 3:22 pm

billtr96sn

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I expect a minimum of 5 years from a lead/acid battery, so going that a gel costs at least 4 times as much then they should last at least 20 years to breaking even and I cannot see that happening.


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20Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Fri Jun 20, 2014 4:58 pm

Be made

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@billtr96sn wrote:I expect a minimum of 5 years from a lead/acid battery, so going that a gel costs at least 4 times as much then they should last at least 20 years to breaking even and I cannot see that happening.
Nice observation. Thanks

    

21Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Fri Jun 20, 2014 6:23 pm

Inge K.

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@K75cster wrote:The old Mareg BMW batt lasted 7 years, the Mareg before it lasted 10, The 7 year batt was because I left the bike with my little brother whilst I travelled by Caravan around OZ and when I got back to my bike it was as flat as, so only 7 years. I now have a Motobatt bought last year

The Mareg fitted from factory on my RS did last 9 years and 2 months.


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Inge K.
K100RS -86. (first owner), K1100LTSE -94.
    

22Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Fri Jun 20, 2014 10:47 pm

AL-58

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The Exides that BMW have been fitting more recentlydont have that sort of reputation.  Pretty poor mostly.

Al


__________________________________________________
'87 K100RS/HRD sidecar (1100 motor)  sc25 
'92 K100RS-16v (Paint it Black)

'87 K100RT with Paralever backend

"When I'm too old and too foolish to handle a sidecar I'll buy a Sportsbike"

Battery Business K-dogs10
    

23Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Sat Jun 21, 2014 1:44 am

billtr96sn

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I think it is because the Exides these days are no longer made in the UK but outsourced to either China or India and along with penny pinching you get the loss in quality.

Little bit of history, Exides used to be made in Dagenham near the Ford factory as Fords were their largest customer.


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Something witty is supposed to go here... help!! Battery Business Uk-log10
http://www.billsbikechat.co.uk
    

24Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Sat Jun 21, 2014 5:14 am

Inge K.

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@AL-58 wrote:The Exides that BMW have been fitting more recentlydont have that sort of reputation.  Pretty poor mostly.

Al


+1. Not unusual with a lifetime around two years.

Also did read somewhere that back then Exide did buy Mareg,
and the doors was closed and locked a couple of years later.


__________________________________________________
Inge K.
K100RS -86. (first owner), K1100LTSE -94.
    

25Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:42 am

Be made

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Hmm. . . this is going to be interesting. I got a Yuasa, made in USA, thats what was in the bike when I got it so I bought another one same model and specs, lead / acid. It is 20 months old now. If I get 36 months out of it I will be very happy.

Wonder if they are any good? guess only time will tell

These guys "appear" to know there stuff, at least:

http://www.yuasabatteries.com/faqs.php?action=1&id=32

"Conventional batteries typically only last 2 to 3 years on average. Although, 4 to 5 years is possible, in the best environments, and with excellent maintenance."

Sealed AGM batteries typically last 3 to 5 years on average. 6 to 8 years is easily obtainable with proper maintenance.

http://www.yuasabatteries.com/history.php



Last edited by Be made on Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:52 am; edited 1 time in total

    

26Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:50 am

charlie99

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yuasa have a very high reputation here in aussie (amongst all the electronics mob )....if that helps


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'86 K100 RT..#0090401 ..."Gerty" ( Gertrude Von Clickandshift ) --------O%OBattery Business Au-log10

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27Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:52 am

Be made

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@charlie99 wrote:yuasa have a very high reputation here in aussie (amongst all the electronics mob )....if that helps
Yep . . . same here. and it does (help) :-)

and. wow . . . I found this;;REALLY interesting stuff

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/water_loss_acid_stratification_and_surface_charge

    

28Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Thu Jun 26, 2014 3:54 am

K75cster

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@Inge K. wrote:
@K75cster wrote:The old Mareg BMW batt lasted 7 years, the Mareg before it lasted 10, The 7 year batt was because I left the bike with my little brother whilst I travelled by Caravan around OZ and when I got back to my bike it was as flat as, so only 7 years. I now have a Motobatt bought last year

The Mareg fitted from factory on my RS did last 9 years and 2 months.

Sorry I'm late here but Thanks Inge K I'll be able to tell my little brother by how much he dropped the life of my Battery 2years 2moths Taa


__________________________________________________
Keith - 1987 K75c with r100rt replica fairing and half of a 1984 K100rt 1992 K1100LT a blue one

The Clever are adept at extricating themselves from situations that the wise would have avoided from the outset - QUOTE from david Hillel in Out of the Earth.
    

29Back to top Go down   Battery Business Empty Re: Battery Business on Thu Jun 26, 2014 11:55 am

Ghost who rides

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As far as lead acid goes, 6 years is my average , car or bike, because I only use Century/ Yuasa,
one bought out the other I believe. At $90 for the bike I can put up with the corr.. What corrosion?
You mean that slight bloom in the Aluminium that you wipe off every couple of years?
Lead acid has way more grunt than the K needs IF used every few days.
Most of us aren;t that lucky and the Odessey and similar are great at holding start charge longer. 
My K100 OZ will have 2 lightweight AGM or similar batts but only because the stock position will be
taken up by a custom fuel tank, said 2 batts will be small and skinny but more importantly easily
"jump startable", to help out other riders of course!


__________________________________________________
1986  K 75 C   2nd owner 187,000kms showing .
1987  K100RT  Police repainted, rough and unloved.
    

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