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1Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty How to rebuild Koni shock? Thu Dec 09, 2021 8:20 pm

Snod Blatter

Snod Blatter
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This is a long shot, but does anyone here have a clue how to rebuild the old Koni 3014-1009 KBA-90279 for 8v K100s and K75s? I've been a silly boy and bought this. I've replaced the gland nut seal in some Dial-A-Rides previously and frankly it was pretty easy so I thought this would be fine. But this isn't a Dial-A-Ride at all and upon inspection it looks pretty difficult, and not just because it's charged with gas..

The most useful thread I've found is this one but he never got as far as removing the gland nut. The problem is that the nut is smooth with no holes in it, and also the sides are chamfered so no real way to get mold grips on it to twist it out (which is how I did it previously!).
How to rebuild Koni shock? UyLzED3
Does it turn out? Do I bash it out like this? Not that there's any lip to drift against. But then there's nothing to turn against either..

Secondly, the rod in mine has no adjusting holes at the top to set the rebound damping:
How to rebuild Koni shock? Lg0y0NR
Replacement rod maybe? It also spins around freely, no clicks or anything - any owners of one of these shocks able to tell me if it should click or hit a barrier after turning a few times? I find it very strange. It also comes up short in the end piece, leaving a ~2mm air gap above it when everything is tightened in place. It's just weird.

So, uhh, any pointers? Cool


__________________________________________________
1989 K100RS SE ABS 8v  VIN: 0149214
Others: 1.5 x CBX250RS-E, '94 CB250, '95 TRX850, '16 Z250SL, '01 R1100GS
http://justbikethings.blogspot.co.uk/
    

2Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Thu Dec 09, 2021 10:16 pm

92KK 84WW Olaf

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I have one of those on my 92 K100LT. Damn nice shock!! Needs a rebuild though, cosmetic reasons.


__________________________________________________
1992 K100LT 0193214 Bertha Blue 101,000 miles
1984 K100RT 0022575 Brutus Baja Red 578 bought 36,000 now 89,150 miles
1997 K1100LT 0188024 Wotan Mystic Red 689 58,645 now 106,950 miles Deceased.
1983 K100RS 0011157 Fricka 606 Alaska Blue 29,495 miles Damn K Pox Its a Bat outta Hell Now 58,200 miles. 
1996 K1100LT 0233004 Lohengrin Mystic Red 38,000 miles currently 48,061 miles.
1983 K100RS 0004449 Odette R100 colours 58,000 miles. Sprint fairing now 61,190 miles

Past:
1968 Yamaha 80 YG1
1971 Yamaha 125 YAS-1
1968 Honda 125 SS
1970 Honda CD 175
1973 Honda CB500-4
Honda CX 500
    

3Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Fri Dec 10, 2021 1:23 am

clappy

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I reached out to Ikon, the company that bought the rights to Koni or something.
They told me that Koni used aluminum damper rod that wears badly if the suspension fluid breaks down. They basically talked me out of having them rebuild it since the spring itself is $200 and then the damper rod may need replacing. I bought a YSS MZ366 but have not had the chance to ride it yet.

Also, if it’s the same as mine I believe rebound is set at the bottom, not the top.

    

4Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Fri Dec 10, 2021 6:11 pm

Snod Blatter

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I didn't expect any replies to this at all so this is a good start Laughing

Olaf - I was very impressed with the Dial-A-Rides that I used, they were stiff enough to keep the bike under control at all times and yet supple, not harsh. I usually fit Hagons because they can be found cheaply but they are dire in comparison, crashy most of the time until you start to really press on when they go all floppy - the one on my K at the moment is just the same. Anyway, if you have one, how does the adjuster feel? Does it spin the whole rod or is it a rod-in-a-rod like the Dial-A-Ride design? Can you keep spinning it forever or does it stop?

clappy - The aluminium damper rod makes sense. Somehow it doesn't feel as smooth or as, err, sticky (?) as chromed steel would. The top of the rod where it has been cut/sawn is also rough and galled, like you would expect from aluminium and not steel. I also tapped the top with a spanner and it left marks, deeper than I would've expected with steel. I can also wiggle the rod side to side slightly, and initially suspected this may be why the seal leaks but thought it may just be because it's loose at the bottom or something like that. The wear makes sense. I wonder how much a rod would be..! I wish I had something precise enough to measure the rod at different points but I don't, not even a pair of verniers at present.

I have seen pictures of these shocks with a red plastic knob for adjustment at the end of the cylinder, I guess that is the version you have. They also look like a slimmer design? Mine definitely doesn't have any plastic adjuster knobs, it's supposed to be turned at the end of the rod by sticking something into some very small holes and twisting it round. Except I don't have the holes either..
How to rebuild Koni shock? Iesf7od

Thanks for the help so far, but it would be nice to know if this is working properly or if it's already somehow broken inside since the adjustment doesn't seem to do anything. The spring is a little moth eaten but seems structurally sound, it's the least of my worries for now..


__________________________________________________
1989 K100RS SE ABS 8v  VIN: 0149214
Others: 1.5 x CBX250RS-E, '94 CB250, '95 TRX850, '16 Z250SL, '01 R1100GS
http://justbikethings.blogspot.co.uk/
    

5Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Fri Dec 10, 2021 8:05 pm

Rick G

Rick G
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Koni shocks that were made by KONI had chromed shafts however there were some KONI brand that were made by IKON and branded KONI and they were the ones with aluminium shafts and were non rebuildable. Then IKON produced their own design under the IKON brand which were absolute junk and not even fit for scrap (how many broken shafts did we se) and the design has not changed.
Ring Adrian at realm engineering and get a RAM shock Price is half that of an IKON and quality infinitely better. My opinion is that the RAM is every bit as good as Ohlins.


__________________________________________________
"Man sacrifices his health in order to make money.
Then he sacrifices money to recuperate his health.
And then he is so anxious about the future that he does not enjoy the present; the result being that he does not live in the present or the future; he lives as if he is never going to die, and then dies having never really lived."   Dalai Lama


Bikes 2004 K1200GT (crashed I lived it died) 1999 K1100 LT.
    

6Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Sat Dec 11, 2021 7:07 pm

Dai

Dai
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What this man says about RamShoks ^^. And they're rebuildable by Realm Engineering at a reasonable price (but don't ask me what it was because I've loooong forgotten Very Happy  ).


__________________________________________________
1983 K100 naked upgraded to K100LT spec after spending time as an RS and an RT
1987 K100RT
Others...
1978 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, 1979 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,1993 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California
2020 Royal Enfield Bullet 500
    

7Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Sat Dec 11, 2021 9:01 pm

92KK 84WW Olaf

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My Koni is the genuine article.

Have a RAM on the K1100LT.....Koni is a nicer shock!!!! Need to get the RAM looked at because front end has just been done and its exposd the rear as not being right.


__________________________________________________
1992 K100LT 0193214 Bertha Blue 101,000 miles
1984 K100RT 0022575 Brutus Baja Red 578 bought 36,000 now 89,150 miles
1997 K1100LT 0188024 Wotan Mystic Red 689 58,645 now 106,950 miles Deceased.
1983 K100RS 0011157 Fricka 606 Alaska Blue 29,495 miles Damn K Pox Its a Bat outta Hell Now 58,200 miles. 
1996 K1100LT 0233004 Lohengrin Mystic Red 38,000 miles currently 48,061 miles.
1983 K100RS 0004449 Odette R100 colours 58,000 miles. Sprint fairing now 61,190 miles

Past:
1968 Yamaha 80 YG1
1971 Yamaha 125 YAS-1
1968 Honda 125 SS
1970 Honda CD 175
1973 Honda CB500-4
Honda CX 500
    

8Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Sun Dec 12, 2021 2:16 am

Jamie64

Jamie64
Silver member
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Have a look at the YSS shock. I have had them on a few bike now and been very happy with them.

I have an Olins on my K1100RS only because it was on it when i purchased it, otherwise i would have fitted a YSS.

https://www.bskspeedworks.co.uk/yss-rear-shocks.html

Cheers Jamie


__________________________________________________
K1100RS 1993
Moto Morini 3 1/2 1974
R9T Racer 2017
    

9Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Sun Dec 12, 2021 3:08 pm

MartinW

MartinW
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I'm running a custom YSS shock and very happy. It was set up spot on straight out of the box. And a very good price and excellent service from JAX. https://www.k100-forum.com/t16492-yss-shock-through-jax-melbourne-shorten-centre-stand
Regards Martin.


__________________________________________________
1992 K75s
    

10Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Mon Dec 13, 2021 2:41 pm

Snod Blatter

Snod Blatter
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The Koni/IKON thing is quit interesting and does explain why the narrower version with the red adjuster knob was turning up in my Koni related searches. However, a magnet proves that the rod/shaft in mine is some kind of steel.

Olaf, is it a secret as to how the adjuster works on yours? Laughing 

I'm not really in the market for a new shock, the Hagon is still holding the back of the bike up in its okay kind of way. But I could get a Koni on there for a small sum of money, that would be neat.


__________________________________________________
1989 K100RS SE ABS 8v  VIN: 0149214
Others: 1.5 x CBX250RS-E, '94 CB250, '95 TRX850, '16 Z250SL, '01 R1100GS
http://justbikethings.blogspot.co.uk/
    

11Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Mon Dec 13, 2021 11:15 pm

Avenger GT

Avenger GT
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It is many years since I had anything to do with adjusting damping on Koni shocks, and then it was on cars not bikes. The proceedure involved pushing the damper rod all the way in, and turning it slowly around, (keeping pressure on all the time) until it drops down into a slot. Then you turn it anticlockwise until it stops, counting the turns. To stiffen the damping, turn clockwise, counting the turns in half turn steps past the original position until you are happy with the setting. It is a bit awkward on a rally car if you have to pull them off the car a few times. I ran a set of them on a Hillman Avenger rally car for 21 years, and never had to rebuild them. Definitely a quality product.

    

12Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Tue Dec 14, 2021 3:12 am

92KK 84WW Olaf

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Hey Avenger GT......

Meet up at Stradbally Fayre 28 December 11am....eccentrics Christmas Brunch and pudding...love to see you there if you can make it. John Ryan has signed up for it and possibly going by car....or meet at Mother Hubbards Cashel about 9.15am for coffee to leave at  9:45am.


__________________________________________________
1992 K100LT 0193214 Bertha Blue 101,000 miles
1984 K100RT 0022575 Brutus Baja Red 578 bought 36,000 now 89,150 miles
1997 K1100LT 0188024 Wotan Mystic Red 689 58,645 now 106,950 miles Deceased.
1983 K100RS 0011157 Fricka 606 Alaska Blue 29,495 miles Damn K Pox Its a Bat outta Hell Now 58,200 miles. 
1996 K1100LT 0233004 Lohengrin Mystic Red 38,000 miles currently 48,061 miles.
1983 K100RS 0004449 Odette R100 colours 58,000 miles. Sprint fairing now 61,190 miles

Past:
1968 Yamaha 80 YG1
1971 Yamaha 125 YAS-1
1968 Honda 125 SS
1970 Honda CD 175
1973 Honda CB500-4
Honda CX 500
    

13Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Tue Dec 14, 2021 1:40 pm

Snod Blatter

Snod Blatter
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Avenger - it definitely doesn't work like that, the shock is full of gas and the rod always wants to pop back out again. Not like the purely oil based ones (like the 7610s) where you can push the rod in and it'll stay there if there's no spring.

To steal a pic from the thread I referenced at the start, the holes for the adjuster are at the very bottom of this image:
How to rebuild Koni shock? Img_0823
Something has to be poked into them and the holes twisted around. Since the "eye" end of the shock is tightened on to the rod, if the whole rod is turned around by the adjuster then you'd have to remove the shock to change the rebound damping setting, and that's mad. And it also doesn't make sense, since there are + and - marks either side of the holes as if it turns separately to the rest.

Stumped, I am. Bemused, is was.


__________________________________________________
1989 K100RS SE ABS 8v  VIN: 0149214
Others: 1.5 x CBX250RS-E, '94 CB250, '95 TRX850, '16 Z250SL, '01 R1100GS
http://justbikethings.blogspot.co.uk/
    

14Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Tue Dec 14, 2021 1:44 pm

Avenger GT

Avenger GT
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Hi Olaf, won't be around on 28th, got something else on.

    

15Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Thu Dec 16, 2021 1:02 pm

Dai

Dai
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Think youz overlooking the obvious, Snod. Them's 'oles for sticking bits in to prevent the rod from turning when the nut is tightened up. Maybe bounce

[edit]. There is another possibility. Slacken the (very rusty) nut, turn the rod to set the rebound damper and then tighten the nut up again.


__________________________________________________
1983 K100 naked upgraded to K100LT spec after spending time as an RS and an RT
1987 K100RT
Others...
1978 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, 1979 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,1993 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California
2020 Royal Enfield Bullet 500
    

16Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Fri Dec 17, 2021 2:18 am

charlie99

charlie99
VIP
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a 2.5mm allen key will fit those holes and let you rotate the adjuster about 45-60 degrees at a time

but i would surmise that some one has been inside there before and assembled without the adjuster fitted ....  ?


__________________________________________________
cheezy grin whilst riding, kinda bloke ....oh the joy !!!! ...... ( brick aviator )

'86 K100 RT..#0090401 ..."Gerty" ( Gertrude Von Clickandshift ) --------O%O
'86 k100 rs.. #######..  "Fred " (f(rame) red ) ( Fredrick leichtundschnell ) - -
bits and pieces from many kind friends across the k100 world ...with many thanks ..
1987 k100rs ########   "Red"  - (red sports rs TWB style )
1989 K100rt #009637   "Black Betty"  (naked rt ala Nigel , now sporting an rs main fairing )
    

17Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Fri Dec 17, 2021 11:45 am

Snod Blatter

Snod Blatter
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Dai wrote:Think youz overlooking the obvious, Snod. Them's 'oles for sticking bits in to prevent the rod from turning when the nut is tightened up. Maybe bounce

[edit]. There is another possibility. Slacken the (very rusty) nut, turn the rod to set the rebound damper and then tighten the nut up again.
No need to stop the rod from turning when it just seems to twirl round and round with nothing happening! The nut seems to be used to lock the eye in place so that it is flat against the bolt/shank/whatever you put through it. It is possible that the rod is twisted round inside the eye piece (honestly what is that end called? I'd like to know the correct jargon..) and to do that you would need to loosen the lock nut, but that would be a pain of a job with the spring in the way!

charlie99 wrote:but i would surmise that some one has been inside there before and assembled without the adjuster fitted ....  ?
This is the interesting thing, there is no adjuster on mine, nor any provision for one. I see I've not supplied a picture of the end of the rod, best fix that..
How to rebuild Koni shock? YkuxCg6
No way for a separate rod to run down the inside like the 7610s have. But I cannot be sure that this is an original rod!

Quick pic of the + and - marks on the eye, too:
How to rebuild Koni shock? 7YVB0cf
I really wonder if this is a replacement rod made by someone, maybe solid so that it could take the strain of a sidecar or something. There are marks on the gland nut/cover that suggest someone has at least tried to get inside, and the seal in the gland nut/cover is from Eriks which may or may not be original.

I can't imagine you'd have to disassemble the shock to set the rebound, but I don't know for sure.. Olaf could help but he's dodging the question like a politician so far Laughing


__________________________________________________
1989 K100RS SE ABS 8v  VIN: 0149214
Others: 1.5 x CBX250RS-E, '94 CB250, '95 TRX850, '16 Z250SL, '01 R1100GS
http://justbikethings.blogspot.co.uk/
    

18Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Sat Dec 18, 2021 2:55 am

charlie99

charlie99
VIP
VIP
perhaps they have used a different hat to the shock rod ?


__________________________________________________
cheezy grin whilst riding, kinda bloke ....oh the joy !!!! ...... ( brick aviator )

'86 K100 RT..#0090401 ..."Gerty" ( Gertrude Von Clickandshift ) --------O%O
'86 k100 rs.. #######..  "Fred " (f(rame) red ) ( Fredrick leichtundschnell ) - -
bits and pieces from many kind friends across the k100 world ...with many thanks ..
1987 k100rs ########   "Red"  - (red sports rs TWB style )
1989 K100rt #009637   "Black Betty"  (naked rt ala Nigel , now sporting an rs main fairing )
    

19Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Sat Dec 18, 2021 6:57 pm

Snod Blatter

Snod Blatter
Life time member
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Anything is possible with this, but the general patina of it seems in line with the rest of the shock, I wouldn't say it's from something else. But then, something clearly is not original..

Might be time to stop thinking about it and have an actual go at getting the top off the gland, the mystery is only getting deeper here.


__________________________________________________
1989 K100RS SE ABS 8v  VIN: 0149214
Others: 1.5 x CBX250RS-E, '94 CB250, '95 TRX850, '16 Z250SL, '01 R1100GS
http://justbikethings.blogspot.co.uk/
    

20Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Mon Dec 20, 2021 5:35 am

K75cster

K75cster
Life time member
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I cant help you with that shockie, mine has the sweep for the damping adjustment at the other end, the body end not the shaft end.

Mine was rebuilt in QLD it has a shrader valve fitted, its filled with nitrogen, you'd have to adapt a refill charge canister from a tyre inflation kit to remove the air and have it charged with nitrogen when you finish digging about inside it.


__________________________________________________
Keith - 1987 K75c with r100rt replica fairing and half of a 1984 K100rt 1992 K1100LT a blue one

The Clever are adept at extricating themselves from situations that the wise would have avoided from the outset - QUOTE from david Hillel in Out of the Earth.
    

21Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Wed Dec 22, 2021 2:34 pm

j_kbike

j_kbike
New member
New member
I also have one of those Koni shocks. It's still up on a shelf. 'Looked around, and also communicated with IKON, trying to see if I could get someone to rebuild. --- Not because I didn't think I could find a good or better shock, but because the KONI shock was so popular on K100s back in the 80s. Like Luftmeister pipes (which I also have in need of repair). I thought it would be cool to include it in my 85 K100RS restoration. --- One day I'll dig into it myself, so wouldn't mind hearing that someone had already done the same and shared the experience.How to rebuild Koni shock? Koni_s10

    

22Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Wed Dec 22, 2021 3:04 pm

Snod Blatter

Snod Blatter
Life time member
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j_kbike wrote:I also have one of those Koni shocks. It's still up on a shelf.
That's the badger! How does the rebound adjustment work?? Does it turn the whole rod around? Does it click into place?

I'm preoccupied with Xmas presents, MOTs and flat batteries at the moment so haven't touched this yet.


__________________________________________________
1989 K100RS SE ABS 8v  VIN: 0149214
Others: 1.5 x CBX250RS-E, '94 CB250, '95 TRX850, '16 Z250SL, '01 R1100GS
http://justbikethings.blogspot.co.uk/
    

23Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Wed Dec 22, 2021 4:04 pm

Point-Seven-five

Point-Seven-five
Life time member
Life time member
Wasn't there a shock back in the 70's where you removed the spring and the bump stop so you could push the rod all the way into the shock so you could turn the damping adjustment with it?  Was it made by Koni? 

I never had one myself, but I seem to recall one of the guys I raced with had some on his bike.


__________________________________________________
Present: 1991 K100RS "Moby Brick Too"
 
Past:
1994 K75RT "Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS"
1988 K100RS SE "Special Ed"
1994 K75S "Cheetos"
1992 K100RS "Moby Brick" R.I.P.
1982 Honda FT500
1979 Honda XR185
1977 Honda XL125
1974 Honda XL125
1972 OSSA Pioneer 250
1968 Kawasaki 175
    

24Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Wed Dec 22, 2021 4:18 pm

Snod Blatter

Snod Blatter
Life time member
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Avenger GT talks about that in post #11. As I say in post #13, the rod always wants to pop out again as it's under pressure from the gas inside. I'm pretty sure you don't need to remove the spring, release the gas, push the rod in and then twist, and then re-gas and re-fit the spring. Surely??

EDIT: I just tried it because there's nothing to lose. Even fully pushed in, the rod just twirls round freely. And now whatever internal platform is held up by the gas is also stuck at the bottom, so I have the floppiest shock there could ever be. Oh well!


__________________________________________________
1989 K100RS SE ABS 8v  VIN: 0149214
Others: 1.5 x CBX250RS-E, '94 CB250, '95 TRX850, '16 Z250SL, '01 R1100GS
http://justbikethings.blogspot.co.uk/
    

25Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Thu Dec 23, 2021 4:25 am

Gaz

Gaz
Life time member
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I have been watching this thread with some interest and had a feeling that deep in the archives in my garage I might still have a Koni pamphlet that I had collected years ago.

Well! after much searching I have found said document and while it my not be the answer some are looking for it may add to the discussion.
So here's my Christmas contribution to this discussion.

Cheers
How to rebuild Koni shock? Koni_i10


__________________________________________________
Gaz
1990 K75 6427509; 1987 R80G/S PD 6292136; 2010 G650GS ZW13381; 95 K1100LT 0232224
    

26Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Thu Dec 23, 2021 5:21 am

TacKler

TacKler
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Good work Gaz,  

I have a Koni that is up for sale but I was going to wait till the new year to advertise it as people probably don't have the money at the moment.    

Dave.


__________________________________________________
Red 1991 K75S
    

27Back to top Go down   How to rebuild Koni shock? Empty Re: How to rebuild Koni shock? Thu Dec 23, 2021 6:14 am

Ringfad

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Gaz wrote:I have been watching this thread with some interest and had a feeling that deep in the archives in my garage I might still have a Koni pamphlet that I had collected years ago.

I have also been watching this as I have one of these on my K100RS. It is still working and now I know how to adjust it even though over the years I have had the bike it has behaved very well.


__________________________________________________
How to rebuild Koni shock? Ir-log10

   ;BMW; K100RS Style Black 1987 105K Km     ;BMW; K1 Black 1993 60K Km     ;BMW;  K1100RS Black 1996       ;BMW; K1 Blue 1990 25K Miles
    

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