BMW K bikes (Bricks)

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1Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Flooding after trickle charging on Wed May 13, 2020 9:28 am

audibob

audibob
Life time member
Life time member
Hi all,

I put my trickle charger on over night yesterday and when I started her this morning I had fuel dripping out

from the rear of the motor, plus a nice k bike blue smoke haze wafting up the street.

The system dried up quickly, but this is the second time this has happened after leaving her on charge .

 I could hear the something buzzing as I turned the ignition on.

My pump is original, new FPR and she runs very well, but this is annoying

Any ideas ?  really odd.

Bob


__________________________________________________
Yamaha 90
Honda CD 175
Honda CB 360 
Triumph T 140V Bonneville
Triumph T150 Trident
Honda CB750 F1
Cz 175
Yamaha XS 750
R 100/7
R 80
K100 LT
K100 LT current bike
    

2Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Re: Flooding after trickle charging on Wed May 13, 2020 12:19 pm

moriarti

moriarti
Silver member
Silver member
Hi Bob easy peasy next time disconnect battery,when charging.Then listen for the buzzzzz when you reconnect,bit of a faf but worth it  Very Happy The last thing you need is a BIG BANG.


__________________________________________________
1984 k100 rs red/black VIN  0004449
    

3Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Flooding after trickle charging on Wed May 13, 2020 1:47 pm

audibob

audibob
Life time member
Life time member
Hi Moriarti,

will do that next time, although as I use the bike regularly its not often I have to.

I need to understand why, after charging the battery the pump runs after switching the ignition on.

After turning the ignition on a second time, I could not hear the pump running.

My charger is a C-tek MX 7.0 on a 4 post Motobatt battery.

Bob


__________________________________________________
Yamaha 90
Honda CD 175
Honda CB 360 
Triumph T 140V Bonneville
Triumph T150 Trident
Honda CB750 F1
Cz 175
Yamaha XS 750
R 100/7
R 80
K100 LT
K100 LT current bike
    

4Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Re: Flooding after trickle charging on Wed May 13, 2020 3:23 pm

moriarti

moriarti
Silver member
Silver member
Hi Bob,until a spark guru posts the answer,how good is the battery?? a poor/lazy 
one can cause havoc on a K,what is the alternator putting out,if you wish change/swap fuel pump relay to eliminate that.On the early Ks you dont hear the pump per/say unless you open fuel cap and stick one ear in Shocked


__________________________________________________
1984 k100 rs red/black VIN  0004449
    

5Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Re: Flooding after trickle charging on Wed May 13, 2020 4:53 pm

92KK 84WW Olaf

92KK 84WW Olaf
Life time member
Life time member
If your signature of a K100LT is correct its a 2v engine and pump should NOT run after you turn on the ignition.

Sounds like issue of fuel pump relay.....stuck. But does it buzz as soon as you connect the battery.....is FPR connected right way round....


__________________________________________________
1992 K100LT 0193214 Bertha Alaska Blue 101,000 miles
1984 K100RT 0022575 Brutus Baja Red 578 bought 36,000 now 89,150 miles
1997 K1100LT 0188024 Wotan Mystic Red 689 58,645 now 103,800 miles
1983 K100RS 0011171 Fricka 606 29,495 miles Damn K Pox Its a Bat outta Hell Now 36,188  miles
    

6Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Flooding after trickle charging on Wed May 13, 2020 5:22 pm

audibob

audibob
Life time member
Life time member
Moriarti,

battery is good, charging good, and I do not normally hear the fuel pump at all.

Olaf, yes mine is a 2 valve and when I removed  the battery from the bike to charge it, there was no issue 

afterwards.

The FPR is newish and fitted correctly.

This only happens whilst trickle charging with the battery in situ and fully connected to the system.

Although my c-tek showed green, ie fully charged , I left in on overnight .

The buzzing noise was quite loud.. 

Perhaps I should leave it on charge again, but disconnect the fuel pump connector to see if it is the relay

buzzing.

Bob


__________________________________________________
Yamaha 90
Honda CD 175
Honda CB 360 
Triumph T 140V Bonneville
Triumph T150 Trident
Honda CB750 F1
Cz 175
Yamaha XS 750
R 100/7
R 80
K100 LT
K100 LT current bike
    

7Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Re: Flooding after trickle charging on Wed May 13, 2020 7:15 pm

MartinW

MartinW
Life time member
Life time member
Try pulling the fuel pump fuse #6 Kraftstoppe, and see if the noise is still present.
Regards Martin.


__________________________________________________
K75s Hybrid
    

8Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Flooding on Wed May 13, 2020 9:43 pm

daveyson

daveyson
Life time member
Life time member
I think you're saying your cranking it while the charger is connected, not good. Disconnect the charger before starting, problem solved.


__________________________________________________
11/1985 bmw k100rt (late model)  Vin. 0090567
    

9Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Flooding after trickle charging on Thu May 14, 2020 11:15 am

audibob

audibob
Life time member
Life time member
The bike is never started whilst hooked up, 

MartinW does fuse 6 isolate the fuel pump or the relay too.

Which colour wire is the live for the fuel pump, so I can test it without spraying fuel everywhere.

Although lock down is here, motorcycle riding is now classed as leisure so I am trying to make excuses 

to get out and ride.  

Garden is a priority at the moment, so I will get around to checking a few things later in the year.

Bob


__________________________________________________
Yamaha 90
Honda CD 175
Honda CB 360 
Triumph T 140V Bonneville
Triumph T150 Trident
Honda CB750 F1
Cz 175
Yamaha XS 750
R 100/7
R 80
K100 LT
K100 LT current bike
    

10Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Re: Flooding after trickle charging on Thu May 14, 2020 2:03 pm

Arlina

Arlina
Life time member
Life time member


__________________________________________________
Flooding after trickle charging Eu-log10  K1100RS/LT - R1200RT - R1100RS (RIP) - Cagiva SST 350 Ala Verde
    

11Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Re: Flooding after trickle charging on Thu May 14, 2020 2:23 pm

volador

volador
Life time member
Life time member
the FI relay is before the Fuse 6 which isolates the fuel pump leg of circuit

What wire are you referring to for test fuel pump- The inner petrol tank fuel pump wires or the external wires to 4-pin connector?

A dirty or faulty starter motor can be cause of unexplained electrical gremlins

STARTER MOTOR REBUILD

Starter Backspin

Robmack's Starter Motor Cleaning Tutorial



Last edited by volador on Fri May 15, 2020 1:43 am; edited 1 time in total


__________________________________________________
1984 K100RS  1991 K100RS  Reap The Wild Wind... Ever Commute Is An Adventure
    

12Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Re: Flooding after trickle charging on Thu May 14, 2020 8:27 pm

indian036

indian036
Life time member
Life time member
I routinely use various sizes of C-Tek chargers on my bikes, and occasionally start one, forgetting that the C-Tek is still attached. I've never had these issues, so I doubt very much that it is related to the charger. In my experience, the C-Tek is the best of the intelligent chargers.

I'd be looking elsewhere for a solution to the problem.

Bill


__________________________________________________
1985 K100RT  VIN 0028991  My original Very Happy   (Historic rego)
1985 K100RT  VIN 0029036  BOB the Blue Old Bike  (Historic rego)
1990 K100LT  VIN 0190452  Work in progress
1984 K100RT  VIN 0023022  Work needing lots of progress

1986 K100RT  VIN 0090542  Work needing lots and lots of progress
1993 K1100LT  VIN 0183046  Work in progress
1993 K75S  VIN 0213045  Newest toy, slightly non-original
    

13Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Flooding on Thu May 14, 2020 11:28 pm

daveyson

daveyson
Life time member
Life time member
The starter provides earth to just the load shed relay, and it's cranking so the starter has earth. I'm thinking like Olaf says the fuel injection relay shouldn't give power with just ignition on. Either it's getting signal power when it shouldn't (pin 86) or it's stuck on. Dirty contacts inside the fuel injection relay could explain why it's intermittent.

The headlight should turn off while the start button is pressed and it's cranking.

Is the buzz sound the fuel pump, or do you mean you have two sounds, the pump and a buzz?


__________________________________________________
11/1985 bmw k100rt (late model)  Vin. 0090567
    

14Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Re: Flooding after trickle charging on Fri May 15, 2020 2:18 am

volador

volador
Life time member
Life time member
Ignition lock switch full 'ON' > Kill switch 'ON' > will introduce 12V to FI relay Pin86

with a closed Clutch switch > depressed the starter switch > the Electronic ignition module pin #7 sends ground to Pin85 energizing the FI relay > power to fuel pump

The FI relay energizes (+) the fuel pump, the idle switch (TPI sw), the injectors and the air flow meter.


__________________________________________________
1984 K100RS  1991 K100RS  Reap The Wild Wind... Ever Commute Is An Adventure
    

15Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Flooding on Fri May 15, 2020 3:06 am

daveyson

daveyson
Life time member
Life time member
Yep, I should have said it's getting earth when it shouldn't, or it's stuck on.


__________________________________________________
11/1985 bmw k100rt (late model)  Vin. 0090567
    

16Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Flooding after charging on Fri May 15, 2020 4:12 am

audibob

audibob
Life time member
Life time member
I am not really sure whether the buzzing came from the pump or a relay, but it was quite loud.

it did not do it after switching back on a second time.

The fuel was dripping over the exhaust at no 4 cylinder, scary...

I will disconnect the fuel pump external connector and leave her on charge and check for power 

when I disconnect the charger and switch on.

My bike does take a little longer cranking before she fires up, so I need to recheck my pressures.

Both pump screen and fuel filter have been cleaned/ replaced as was the FPR, but the pump is original

as far as I know.

Why the fuel pump runs when it is not designed to, ie, on the key but only after charging is weird..

I will check fuse #6

I have no clutch switch 

I will order a new relay and then try and check a few things 

My starter motor was cleaned last year.

Thanks to all


Bob


__________________________________________________
Yamaha 90
Honda CD 175
Honda CB 360 
Triumph T 140V Bonneville
Triumph T150 Trident
Honda CB750 F1
Cz 175
Yamaha XS 750
R 100/7
R 80
K100 LT
K100 LT current bike
    

17Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Re: Flooding after trickle charging on Fri May 15, 2020 4:19 am

chris846

chris846
Life time member
Life time member
You have no clutch switch?

Does that mean it isn't working, or has been disconnected from the loom - or has someone been in and altered, or tried to alter the wiring so's it doesn't need one? If you think the latter might be the case that could indicate weird 'ignition on' behaviour. The clutch switch/neutal interlock circuit is about as complicated as the wiring gets on a K so a mistake might have been made.


__________________________________________________
Sometimes I'm not really Suzi Quatro.
    

18Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Flooding on Fri May 15, 2020 5:32 am

daveyson

daveyson
Life time member
Life time member
After your tests, while the tank is off, deoxit your earth's and plugs. Voltage drop from poor earth could jam the relay on, a bit like what sometimes happens with the starter relay, maybe. Regardless, it can only be a good thing to give them a clean while you're there.


__________________________________________________
11/1985 bmw k100rt (late model)  Vin. 0090567
    

19Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Flooding after trickle charging on Fri May 15, 2020 6:43 am

audibob

audibob
Life time member
Life time member
I cleaned all the connectors  last year.

There was no clutch / sidestand cable or any clutch switch fitted when I got the bike.

When I get the tank off, I look for the clutch cut out wiring.

This has only happened twice in 40k   so not exactly a regular issue.

Looking at the " what is live " circuit, the relay seems to be favourite.

I will report back in a week or so, railway sleepers  in the garden are my priority at the moment.

Bob


__________________________________________________
Yamaha 90
Honda CD 175
Honda CB 360 
Triumph T 140V Bonneville
Triumph T150 Trident
Honda CB750 F1
Cz 175
Yamaha XS 750
R 100/7
R 80
K100 LT
K100 LT current bike
    

20Back to top Go down   Flooding after trickle charging Empty Flooding on Fri May 15, 2020 5:48 pm

daveyson

daveyson
Life time member
Life time member
By the way, a buzz can sometimes be caused by the output shaft.

Have you ever had a look at the output shaft? Flooding after trickle charging 44271


__________________________________________________
11/1985 bmw k100rt (late model)  Vin. 0090567
    

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