BMW K bikes (Bricks)


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1Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty I need help please start Wed Jan 17, 2024 5:18 am

Ribi

Ribi
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Hi excuse me I've been distracted for a year back on it now 
Ok so Ive got bmw k75 had an accident fitted new engine case after getting   all alloy out of engine engine will and does swing round so I chopped up the loom for my cafe racer so after trying to do that I've got another complete loom it's from an abs model mines non abs but I'm sure that can be binned so it's all fitted and starter won't spin my starter button was busted  so I twisted the green and yellows together and the black black and yellow are at starter button the clutch switch I've joined them together same as pull the clutch and joined  no's 5 and 6 in the cluster plug. I've had relays checked and there all good and a new battery  I've removed the starter it's good  where am I going wrong previous to accident she's a blinder.  Also is anyone on this forum heard about top yoke collapsing under heavy braking I know it's an old bike someone turned in front of me and the yokes shattered And I crashed

    

2Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Wed Jan 17, 2024 12:05 pm

Laitch

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Does your moto have an ignition switch that operates, Ribi?


__________________________________________________
1995 K75 90,000 miles
    

3Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Thu Jan 18, 2024 5:07 am

Ribi

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I fitted a toggle switch years ago .so yes it does sir I use the green wire and the red I don't use the light blue ones thank you latch for your interest

    

4Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Thu Jan 18, 2024 11:24 am

Laitch

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Ribi wrote:I fitted a toggle switch years ago .so yes it does sir I use the green wire and the red  I don't use the light blue ones . . ..
How closely do the colors and location in the attached diagram match those of the wires you're using? This diagram for for K75 wire is one of several from Clymers manual. 
I need help please start  Scree305I need help please start  Scree306


__________________________________________________
1995 K75 90,000 miles
    

5Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Fri Jan 19, 2024 12:53 am

Ribi

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6Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Fri Jan 19, 2024 12:55 am

Ribi

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I'm using this diagram and this matches my bike sir

    

7Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Fri Jan 19, 2024 1:31 am

Laitch

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Ribi wrote: so I twisted the green and yellows together and the black black and yellow are at starter button the clutch
I want to understand what you are doing, Ribi. If you start your sentences with a capital letter and end them with a period that would help separate your ideas better for me. 

In the quote above you, did you mean to write "twisted the green wire and green yellow wire together"? You also refer to a "black black" wire. Did you mean to write "black green wire and black yellow wire"? I'm trying to go by the diagram you posted.

Have you verified there is 12V in the green wire when you're trying to run the starter? Where else have you verified there is 12V during the starter trial?


__________________________________________________
1995 K75 90,000 miles
    

8Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Sun Jan 21, 2024 11:43 pm

Ribi

Ribi
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Dear Mr Laitch,
From the ignition wiring I have used the green wire and the red wire to my push to start button ..
At the right handle bar control switch I have twisted the green wire and the green and yellow wires together for continuity I assume it's the kill switch..
Ii then run the black wire and the black and yellow wires each side of the press to start button..
Power is sent to the starter relay at 12.50 volts and reduses to 9.45v when button is released ...
The brown and red wire in the same plug is constant live at 4.50v

    

9Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Sun Jan 21, 2024 11:46 pm

Ribi

Ribi
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I've tried to include photos to help

    

10Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Sun Jan 28, 2024 10:13 pm

Ribi

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I need help please start  Img_2028
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I need help please start  Img_2030I need help please start  Img_2028
I need help please start  Img_2029
I need help please start  Img_2030I need help please start  Img_2028
I need help please start  Img_2029
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11Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Sun Jan 28, 2024 10:15 pm

Ribi

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Help needed too many photos

    

12Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Mon Jan 29, 2024 1:11 am

firstle

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this is the same post Wiring woes

    

13Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Mon Jan 29, 2024 3:03 am

Ribi

Ribi
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Yes it is but now I have another uncut wiring loom but I cant get the starter to engage any help is welcome and gratefully received thanks

    

14Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Mon Jan 29, 2024 2:46 pm

Two Wheels Better

Two Wheels Better
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Thread moved from Troubleshooting - General to Troubleshooting - Electrical.


__________________________________________________
1977 R75/7-100, 1995 R100 Mystic, 1993 & 1996 K1100RS, 1993 K11/K12 Big Block, 2 x 1998 K1200RS, 2006 K1200R & 2009 K1300GT
    

15Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Tue Jan 30, 2024 7:56 pm

Ribi

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With respect two wheels I'm not getting much advice from any area many thanks for moving me lets hope I can get some help

    

16Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Thu Feb 01, 2024 10:34 pm

Ribi

Ribi
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Hello is there anybody out there. Please help thank you

    

17Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Fri Feb 02, 2024 7:27 pm

Laitch

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Click the Portal box at the top of this page, Ribi, and then click on the Tech Page link. After doing that, click on the I agree button. In the Electrical section that appears, click on the Electrical Diagrams link. That is a diagram of a K100 wiring system that is similar to your K75’s system. At the top of that diagram are boxes. Click on the Starter box. Carefully look over the wiring connections. Look at the red wire connections because those are the 12V connections from the battery. Have you connected all the correct wires to each other so only the starter will operate, or are you expecting the engine to start? 

What is your basic goal right now—getting the starter to rotate the crankshaft, or getting the engine to start? In your other thread about this problem, daveyson gave some interesting suggestions but you did not respond indicating you tried any of them. Starting the engine on your K75 requires more complex electrical connections than those in starting the Hillman Imp you mentioned in your other thread. Laughing Your photos aren't much help to me personally because you don't explain what you are doing in them or why you are doing it. Your description of the wire colors connected to the starter button—presumably the button that was destroyed in the accident—does not seem to agree with the wiring diagram you provided. 

One reason you might not be getting all the help you need here is that the wiring of your motorcycle seems to have been drastically modified by the combined processes of making it into a cafe bike and then crashing it in an accident. Those circumstances make it difficult many of us to recommend the usual methods of troubleshooting. 

The situation isn't hopeless but will likely require abundant patience, understanding, and time from you.


__________________________________________________
1995 K75 90,000 miles
    

18Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Fri Feb 02, 2024 10:10 pm

Ribi

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Thanks for your reply but what don't you understand ? The engine is ready to run I took the chopped up loom off and replaced it with a very good condition second hand for an ABS model which I am confident of doing ..
my bike has no instrument cluster
The ignition switch Ive used for several years with no problem (the original packed up and spare parts are not available in Thailand also expensive to import..
The wiring loom purchased is plugged up exactly plug to plug with correct colours.
When the starter button is pushed the voltages do adjust as they should be.12volts and down to 4.9 volts as I explained before.
My problem is the starter doesn't turn I have I have the correct plug at the starter relay and the relay tested ok.
If I remove the start relay and touch the wires together the starter will turn .
My question is where am I going wrong ? Is there something that needs to be connected at the cluster plug ?
The wires for the clutch safety are connected...
I hope this helps you understand Mr.Laitch.
I am British and if I lived in the UK I'm sure I could have help from my friends but that's not the case I have no support and as you noted the bmw does have a very complex wiring system which is why I abandoned the idea of cafe loom and returned to standard..many thanks

I

    

19Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Fri Feb 02, 2024 10:16 pm

Ribi

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Oh and I feel confident I can remove the ABS section of the loom but haven't at this time as I don't want to open up and start cutting wires until it's running

I

    

20Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Fri Feb 02, 2024 10:19 pm

Ribi

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My goal is to start the bike but first I need to check I have a spark .
The fuel tank is not fitted at this time

    

21Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Fri Feb 02, 2024 10:20 pm

92KK 84WW Olaf

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K bike does not run without the instrument cluster.


__________________________________________________
1992 K100LT 0193214 Bertha Blue 101,000 miles
1984 K100RT 0022575 Brutus Baja Red 578 bought 36,000 now 89,150 miles
1997 K1100LT 0188024 Wotan Mystic Red 689 58,645 now 106,950 miles Deceased.
1983 K100RS 0011157 Fricka 606 Alaska Blue 29,495 miles Damn K Pox Its a Bat outta Hell Now 58,200 miles. 
1996 K1100LT 0233004 Lohengrin Mystic Red 38,000 miles currently 48,061 miles.
1983 K100RS 0004449 Odette R100 colours 58,000 miles. Sprint fairing now 61,190 miles

Past:
1968 Yamaha 80 YG1
1971 Yamaha 125 YAS-1
1968 Honda 125 SS
1970 Honda CD 175
1973 Honda CB500-4
Honda CX 500
    

22Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Sat Feb 03, 2024 1:01 am

firstle

firstle
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not sure about that , i ran one for @10 years with no clocks

    

23Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Sat Feb 03, 2024 1:42 am

Laitch

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firstle wrote:not sure about that , i ran one for @10 years with no clocks
Time must have stood still.


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1995 K75 90,000 miles
    

24Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Sat Feb 03, 2024 7:11 am

Dai

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Craig's right. When troubleshooting LFB few months ago and I decided I needed a new wiring loom, I built one that just allowed the engine to start and nothing else. There weren't even any connectors on it to push into the instrument cluster.







Turned out it wasn't the wiring loom.








It was the bloody thermostat on the engine I need help please start  161205


__________________________________________________
1983 K100 naked upgraded to K100LT spec after spending time as an RS and an RT
1987 K100RT
Others...
1978 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, 1979 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,1993 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California
2020 Royal Enfield Bullet 500
    

25Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Sat Feb 03, 2024 8:21 am

firstle

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i just unplugged mine when they played up and pushed the plugs under the tank , i alway ment to replace them but 1000s of miles latter did not miss them , wish i had kept the bike it was my first k100 1984 ex police . it ran faultless

    

26Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Sat Feb 03, 2024 3:52 pm

Laitch

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Ribi wrote:Thanks for your reply but what don't you understand?
My problem is the starter doesn't turn I have I have the correct plug at the starter relay and the relay tested ok.
If I remove the start relay and touch the wires together the starter will turn .
I don't understand why you believe a 12V starter should work receiving 4.9 volts—if that is what's happening. On the other hand, your sentence structure has improved and is easier to read. cheers


When you write "the starter will turn" when the relay is not in the circuit, is that indicating that the starter motor is spinning but the crankshaft isn't turning?

It's clear to me you need to review all your wiring connections using the electrical wiring diagram that's in the Tech Page located in this site's Portal, accessed by clicking Portal button at the top of this page. When you find the wiring diagram link and open it, click on the box at the top of the page labeled Starter and compare the circuitry with yours. It's K100 wiring but yours is the similar..


__________________________________________________
1995 K75 90,000 miles
    

27Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty No go Sat Feb 03, 2024 8:28 pm

daveyson

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I think you're saying that when you bridge the red and black wires at the starter relay, then the starter turns. When the start button is pressed, this relay should be supplied with power from the black/yellow wire, and earth from the brown/red wire. Maybe it's not getting earth. Connect a temporary earth wire from the brown/red wire to a good earth point on the frame. Give that a try.


__________________________________________________
11/1985 bmw k100rt (late model)  Vin. 0090567
 ~120,000 km
    

28Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Sat Feb 03, 2024 9:34 pm

daveyson

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Ribi wrote:Help needed too many photos

Click on one of the unwanted photos. Press the backspace button a few times. That should do it.


__________________________________________________
11/1985 bmw k100rt (late model)  Vin. 0090567
 ~120,000 km
    

29Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Sat Feb 03, 2024 11:33 pm

Ribi

Ribi
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Thanks daveyson I can do that many thanks couldn't delete photo so please just Ignore them
Thanks to anyone with positive help
Mr Dai. Would you mind sharing the info concerning running the engine on a short loom
Mr Latch. When I press the starter button I get 12+v to relay but believe by pressing the starter it also passes a lower voltage to activate the ignition system (very complex for someone like me) from the relay not before it ....do you understand ? or am I wrong ?
Now I'm going to put the battery on charge so I can do some correct measurements tomorrow and check Mr Daveyson suggestion .
Now I'm going fishing 🎣 ok

    

30Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Sat Feb 03, 2024 11:36 pm

Ribi

Ribi
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Thanks daveyson I can do that many thanks couldn't delete photo so please just Ignore them
Thanks to anyone with positive help
Mr Dai. Would you mind sharing the info concerning running the engine on a short loom
Mr Latch. When I press the starter button I get 12+v to relay but believe by pressing the starter it also passes a lower voltage to activate the ignition system (very complex for someone like me) from the relay not before it ....do you understand ? or am I wrong ?
Now I'm going to put the battery on charge so I can do some correct measurements tomorrow and check Mr Daveyson suggestion .
Now I'm going fishing 🎣 ok

    

31Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Sun Feb 04, 2024 6:40 am

Dai

Dai
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Ribi wrote:Mr Dai. Would you mind sharing the info concerning running the engine on a short loom
That's.... difficult because I still had to build around 60% of the loom to connect all of the required parts together. Effectively, you take the diagram of a standard wiring loom, then remove all the lighting, the horn and the parts that go to the instrument panel. What is left is what you need.


__________________________________________________
1983 K100 naked upgraded to K100LT spec after spending time as an RS and an RT
1987 K100RT
Others...
1978 Moto Guzzi 850-T3, 1979 Moto Guzzi 850-T3 California,1993 Moto Guzzi 1100ie California
2020 Royal Enfield Bullet 500
    

32Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Mon Feb 05, 2024 5:37 am

Ribi

Ribi
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Ok Dai,thank you anyway I do understand I pretty much done the same but it is to complicated for me
Mr.Daveyson ok today had good Earth's to both the brown/red and the black /yellow wires which do go live at 10.14 volts until I press the starter button the volts go to 13 v at both terminals but still no starter motor..
Please tell me if I'm correct in thinking when the start is pressed the black wire bolted to the relay should go live suggesting the relay may be at fault. ( I had the relay tested at a shop and they said it was ok )
Many thanks for your input I will try another relay tomorrow as your day starts mine has ended now and it's too bloody hot now😎

    

33Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty No go Mon Feb 05, 2024 11:27 am

daveyson

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It seems to me that pin 86 (black/yellow) should only have power while the start button is pressed.


__________________________________________________
11/1985 bmw k100rt (late model)  Vin. 0090567
 ~120,000 km
    

34Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Tue Feb 06, 2024 8:33 am

Ribi

Ribi
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Yes sir Mr Daveyson that's what I have.
I've sent a photo of my ecm inside I don't know what I'm looking for but it doesn't smell and I cant see any obvious damage.
Also a photo of the volts at ecm after starter button pushed.
Relay swap made no difference

    

35Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Tue Feb 06, 2024 10:28 pm

Ribi

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I need help please start  Img_2039
I need help please start  Img_2038
I need help please start  Img_2037

    

36Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Help Fri Feb 09, 2024 5:48 am

daveyson

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I think you want to focus on why the starter relay isn't doing it's job. When you press the start button, you should be able to hear and feel a click from the relay.

Yes, when the start button is pressed the black wire should go live.


__________________________________________________
11/1985 bmw k100rt (late model)  Vin. 0090567
 ~120,000 km
    

37Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Wed Feb 14, 2024 4:51 am

Ribi

Ribi
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Hi Mr Daveyson Sir.
Wow so today gotta chance to work on the bike .1 st I thought to clear up a bit check the plugs are clean and in the correct places...nothing out of place so I've done enough today ..
I do recall you saying test the brown/red wire at relay for earth and it wasn't there so I jumped an earth from an accessory plug in the relay box.
Hey presto your the man I pressed button starter swings so I turned it all off and stopped for the day it's really hot and my dog needs a walk..so thank you sir I will now check for sparks and fuel tomorrow if I have time

    

38Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Wed Feb 14, 2024 4:59 am

Ribi

Ribi
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Just 1 question please I recall my bike never ran without clocks I tried years ago but there is conflicting information do you think I should use a false neutral set up like the 3 relays hooked up together?? Thank you

    

39Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Wed Feb 14, 2024 8:09 am

duck

duck
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If you pull in the clutch that closes the clutch switch which sends 12V to the start button. The other thing that sends 12V to the start button is when the bike is in neutral and the gear indicator in the cluster sends 12V out to the start button via Pin 6. 

Both are BLK/GRN wires to Pin 6 of the right combo switch connector.

Summary: Without the instrument cluster a K bike will only start when the clutch is pulled in.

Assumption: Clutch switch is working.


__________________________________________________
Current stable:
86 Custom K100 (standard fairing, K75 Belly pan, Ceramic chromed engine covers, paralever)
K75 Frankenbrick (Paralever, K11 front end, hybrid ABS, K1100RS fairing, radial tires)
86 K75C Turbo w/ paralever
94 K1100RS
93 K1100LT
91 K1
93 K75S (K11 front end)
91 K75S (K1 front end)
14 Yamaha WR250R
98 Taxi Cab K1200RS
14 K1600GT
http://www.ClassicKBikes.com
    

40Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Wed Feb 14, 2024 8:21 am

firstle

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unplug the instruments (mine filled with water) and my 1984 K ran faultless for years

    

41Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Need help Fri Feb 16, 2024 4:33 am

daveyson

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I'm in agreement with duck here. It sounds like there have been examples of bricks running without the cluster, they might have had the wiring altered to suit. If it's a no-go without the cluster, a simple solution is to pull in the clutch before starting.


__________________________________________________
11/1985 bmw k100rt (late model)  Vin. 0090567
 ~120,000 km
    

42Back to top Go down   I need help please start  Empty Re: I need help please start Mon Feb 19, 2024 7:51 am

Ribi

Ribi
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Hi everyone im happy to report they do run without the clocks with some electrical adjustment
Now the bad news it's over fueling I've put the injectors in a catch bottle to look I'm not a professional in the fuel injection but it looked like too much !!
Next question is what do you gentlemen think I should look for. Many thanks it was great to hear her run
Ps I put a paper clip in 5 and six in the cluster plug and joined the clutch wires

    

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